are we still a fair country

[PeterLe]

Jeff
Glad to hear your new job is going well.
Even if you wasn't doing it for the money, it is nice to get out of the "Betting and Trading" environment for a while and talk to people about something other than betfair.
Nobody I work with knows about my trading and its a nice escape..anyway hope it goes well..(Sorry for going off topic!)

Regards
Peter
PS You can also look forward to the Christmas Parties!

[superfrank]

@LeTiss

spot on. the problem is that there isn't a mainstream political party that represents those general common sense views (of a large proportion of the population imho).

Labour and the Lib Dems are still stuck in a fantasy land where the state dictates the success or otherwise of society and the economy. the Tories don't know what land they're in anymore.

it's a shame the working class still vote for Labour en masse - it's only history and habit (and nauseating spin by Labour) that this continues. Labour doesn't represent the working the class - it represents a few intellectual leftie luvvies. the working classes hate immigration, political correctness etc. Labour betrayed the working class by deliberately allowing mass immigration (for their own political gain) at the expense of the working classes.

edit:
@Jeff
congratulations on the new job. you should return the favour and invite the girls to lunch in your car!

[payuppal]

The problem I have with the fringe parties is that they tip very easily over into racism, and that they don't focus on the extent to which the white working class are architects of their own misfortune.

Immigration into this country over the last 60 years has been a lot about finding people to do the jobs that the white working class no longer want or are prepared to do.

So it was with the people brought in from the Commonwealth during the 50s; so it was with the migrants from the EU over the last 20 years.

But neither the BNP nor UKIP want to tell their followers this.

[Ferru123]

Thanks Frank.

I think I'd need to get the car's suspension looked at before I did that!

Jeff

@Jeff
congratulations on the new job. you should return the favour and invite the girls to lunch in your car!

[superfrank]

Immigration into this country over the last 60 years has been a lot about finding people to do the jobs that the white working class no longer want or are prepared to do.

that might have been true in the 50s but it was just an excuse during the latest wave of mass immigration. we have a huge underclass now that are dependant on welfare - the solution to that problem should never have been to import cheap labour (that will just create an even bigger underclass in the future). it has been proved that there is no overall economic benefit to the UK from the immigration of the last 10 or 15 years, but there are social costs including racial tensions, housing, and greater demand for all public services.

[payuppal]

It's fair comment that labour from the EU has depressed wage rates, Polish builders for example, and taken jobs that it would have been better for locals to have.

Though I would prefer to be served by a relatively keen middle European than some chippy English girl who thinks it's all beneath her.

I'm not sure it was an unintended consequence of the EU, an intended plot to drive down labour costs, or a sneaky way of creating a multicultural society..

[mister man]

Immigration into this country over the last 60 years has been a lot about finding people to do the jobs that the white working class no longer want or are prepared to do.

that might have been true in the 50s but it was just an excuse during the latest wave of mass immigration. we have a huge underclass now that are dependant on welfare - the solution to that problem should never have been to import cheap labour (that will just create an even bigger underclass in the future). it has been proved that there is no overall economic benefit to the UK from the immigration of the last 10 or 15 years, but there are social costs including racial tensions, housing, and greater demand for all public services.

spot on superfrank,the notion that we have 4.9M lazy white people who wont work, is insulting and ignorant in the extreme. who benefits from cheap labour,its not those working for poverty wages is it,its mr camerons friends,and those exploiting the desperation of others to work.
a lot of the recent immigrants to this country get preferential treatment to the indigenous population in many many ways,from employment,benefits,and a whole host of services, if any party (other than the fringe nut job parties) was to truly represent the working class we would see a much different political landscape, sadly both new labour and now the lib dems are almost as tory as the tories, hence the huge mess we are all now in.
happy days (not)

[Ferru123]

Workfare programme is a hit with the unemployed: Working for nothing – and proud of it too - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... t-too.html

[payuppal]

I'm not actually saying that the 5.6 million on benefits are all lazy and useless.

Simply that a situation has been allowed to develop that can no longer be sustained, IMO.

It's true that practically all of the jobs created from the mid 1990's onward were taken by immigrants.

If there had been no such choice, they would have been taken by locals, or not filled. For them to have been taken by locals, higher wages would be needed to make it worthwhile coming off benefit.

In practice, there was collusion between the desire for cheap labour and political expediency over benefits.

But we can't afford to continue like this.

By the way, what would the white working class be voting for?

Limit immigration, and cut our benefits so we have to take the low paying jobs now available?

[Ferru123]

Budget 2012: Ed Balls calls for benefits rethink - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17249698

'Mr Balls described the child benefit changes due to come into effect in January 2013 as "perverse anomalies" which would affect hundreds of thousands of families.

He said a family with three children on £43,000, where one person was working, would lose £2,500, while a household with two earners on £42,000 each would keep the child benefit.'

What planet is this guy living on?!?

Since when does a family with an income of £43,000 deserve any benefits from the state???

Jeff