General discussion : Gaming machine payouts: return-to-player

A place to discuss anything.
Post Reply
Derek27
Posts: 3657
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:31 am

Just stumbled across this article on the Gambling Commission site.

http://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/fo ... s-RTP.aspx
Gaming machines, also called fruit machines, slots machines or FOBTs, are required to clearly display the percentage return-to-player figure (% RTP), or the odds of winning a prize.
Whenever I've popped into a bookie I've never bothered looking at the machines, as you can imagine, but I certainly will next time.

Do these machines really warn people that it's a mathematical certainly that you will lose long term?

User avatar
ShaunWhite
Posts: 3829
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:47 am

The appeal of FOBT's is the fact that the RTP is actually so high, usually 97%+, much better returns than the horse odds available at the counter and giving the illusion that hot streaks are possible and the best value bet in the shop.

The danger comes from the rapid turnover they encourage churning your stake into dust at 2 spins a minute. After 15mins you'll have 40% of your money left, another 15mins and it's down to 15%. "But it says 97% on the box so I'll have another £100 and I must be able to hit a few in a row"

They also have insidious 'near miss' scenarios programmed to push every neurological button possible.

The law on fruit machines etc comes from the days of coins and cogs which inherently limited turnover. The simple answer would be to legislate on allowable turnover (fingerprint activated Go buttons registered at the counter, or £1 a spin etc) but the ants nest we're in danger of disturbing is if FOBTs are limited, then why not online bingo, poker and casinos, and if them then why not online bookies or even betfair. They all allow and often encourage rapid gambling. Granted it's highly unlikely because the industry and the treasury would fight it like hell.

But do we really want a 'nanny knows best' state or just accept that self destructive people always have and always will find a way to screw themselves be it gambling, drink, drugs or cake, and the best we can do is to provide what's necessary to pick them up again.

"On tonight's moral maze we have in the studio,...." :)

Derek27
Posts: 3657
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:41 am

I agree the problem is the turnover rate. If 97% is the RTP, gamble £100K and he'll get back £97K, but gamble £1000 (which is probably more than most players will have), and at £100 a spin, he'll either lose the lot, or he might win £2000 and then lose the lot!

For that reason I would support a lower staking limit (the £2 people are calling for may be a bit excessive), but I don't think anyone could ever argue that games that aren't governed by the laws of probability and people are known to win can be targeted in the same way.

What really beats me, is that if they actually tell you you're going to get 97% back on a FOBT but don't tell you what the overround of the next horse race is, why don't FOBT users just throw their money on the horses and hope for more than 97% back?

Do they think a 3% loss is a good investment?

spreadbetting
Posts: 1871
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:06 pm

Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:58 pm

Most FOBT's in London are just used by dealers runners to clean the cash and get a nice little slip as proof it's clean. Can't be many places you can clean your money for a 3% fee by pressing a button on a roulette machine.

User avatar
ShaunWhite
Posts: 3829
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:18 pm

sb's right, there's good things about them as well as bad. ;)

Post Reply

Return to “General discussion”

  • Information
  • Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests