Greening Up in Play DOUBLED MY LIABILITY!?!

[BrianS]

I just had a disaster with this on a football match, it doubled my liability across win lose and my draw gave massive returns. I am very wary of this now.
It was unfortunate as I literally redded up before the goal, literally a second and I got caught both sides of the market.

[Crazyskier]

I just had a disaster with this on a football match, it doubled my liability .

Indeed. This is why sadly I simply cannot use BA for in-play greening. Mr. Webb seems to think that his software uses the same formulae to other software providers, but not once in almost a year of daily play have I found that a green up EVER increased total event liability on the other products I use. This is an issue peculiar to BA I fear.

[Euler]

The formula is simple and replicated by other vendors. But I suspect it's not being used as intended. If somebody can post a log (as previously requested) the guys can have a look.

[jimibt]

The formula is simple and replicated by other vendors. But I suspect it's not being used as intended. If somebody can post a log (as previously requested) the guys can have a look.

i'll dig into my logs tmro -but i too find that BA seems to green out with many unexpected eventualities. I do of course appreciate that this could be related to unmatched bets etc, etc, but it does seem to be a counter intuitive exercise and one that i often dread (especially in play). I sometimes (many times!!) even just resort to using the inbuilt betfair *cash out* function, as this never has any wrinkles, for all it's other failings.

anyway, sorry to be the poop at the party -but me too

[Dallas]

In BrianS’s case from his earlier comments his situation came about simply be clicking the green up button several times in quick succession immediately after a goal was scored and while the market was still re-forming. A combination of this and the Betfair in-play delay will of subsequently caused more than one green up bet to be matched and at unfavourable odds which then required more green up attempts as the market started to settle.

[Blackmoor]

Isn't the issue really with how the green up process is invoked, rather than any fault with the logic or its implementation ?

Obviously manually clicking the green up button in quick succession with inplay delays will result in multiple bets being fired, resulting in an undesired position, but in automation you also need to have the rearm and fill/kill settings higher than (inplay delay + the Guardian refresh time), to avoid firing multiple (unintended) bets in the market.

I learnt this the hard way after laying a winner multiple times, and incurring a hefty loss when I should have won. In my case I should have issued a single lay to green-up, but the 3 lays were fired in by the green up rule, resulting in a net lay position on a horse that went on to win.

Whilst I now have the correct settings for my rule, I also now include an additional test for number of unmatched bets = 0, and haven't had the issue since.

[jimibt]

Whilst I now have the correct settings for my rule, I also now include an additional test for number of unmatched bets = 0, and haven't had the issue since.

i think your safeguard settings and observations make perfect sense and will use these myself. I had set the re-arm at 3 seconds, more by gut feel than any logic and it seemed to mitigate the issue 90% of the time, your addition of unmatched bets = 0 should complete the process.. cheers

[Thebest147]

It might also be worth pointing out something about the effects of the IR delay and refresh rates which is not just applicble to this thread but is something alot of people probebly fall victim to at some point.

Most likely if trading IR you have the refresh set to 200ms which means its getting updates 5 times per seconds from Betfair.

You place your 1st order (back,lay or hedge) and dont see it appear in the market you watch the prices change and refresh 4 times and thinking it has nt worked you click for a 2nd time then instantly on the next refresh you see the order in the market and think "ah done it its worked this time" when in fact this was your 1st order appearing after betfairs 1 sec delay and in another second your 2nd order will also hit the market but you have often turned your attension away at this point thinking you have achived what you intended and dont always relise about this 2nd bet until after the event has finished meaning you now have double the liablity or have just unhedged a poistion your 1st order had sucssefully hedged.

. So are you saying all in running trades should be at 2 second refresh Dallas

[Derek27]

I think he's just saying you need to be aware of the delay and aware of the number of bets you've placed - don't let the delay fool you into thinking the bet didn't go through.

It's crucial to have a rapid refresh rate when trading in-running.

[ShaunWhite]

It might also be worth pointing out something about the effects of the IR delay and refresh rates which is not just applicble to this thread but is something alot of people probebly fall victim to at some point.

. So are you saying all in running trades should be at 2 second refresh Dallas

2 seconds rearm, fastest refresh you can. That's now 1/10th of what it was in 2016, now 20ms.

ie obtain the info as fast as you can, but give the system sufficient time to respond to what you've already done before you try again.

[sionascaig]

I put in a "Time since market suspended" condition to give the market time to reform after a suspension - caught out once but lesson learned...