Overcoming gambling addiction

[Derek27]

After reading the authors post I can’t say he has a gambling addiction but rather a poor mindset.
Only he will truly know that answer...

I disagree. If he has taken the step of asking for help to stop then I think he has a problem.

"How the hell do I stop gambling?"

If the asker of that question doesn't have a gambling addiction I don't know who would!

[SeaHorseRacing]

After reading the authors post I can’t say he has a gambling addiction but rather a poor mindset.
Only he will truly know that answer...

I disagree. If he has taken the step of asking for help to stop then I think he has a problem.

"How the hell do I stop gambling?"

If the asker of that question doesn't have a gambling addiction I don't know who would!

The point I’m trying to make is I believe there are a variety of gamblers...

99% of gamblers lose but 99% are not compulsive gamblers...

Le tiss admits he had a similar problem, I’ve had a similar problem... asking for help doesn’t mean he couldn’t over come his problem.

I lost money because I was an impulsive, petulant, fidgeting lunatic... however a doctor or everyone here if I posted this would say I was a gambling addict...

I took my will power to correct a few issues within my life and it worked for me... it’s worked for le tiss...

I have a friend called Mark, professional gambler... multi millionaire who was submitted to a the priory 20 years ago for gambling...

I will clearly this up imo.. the author should stop. But stopping doesn’t mean he should give up and doesn’t mean he has a real gambling addiction... gamblers are suppose to lose..

My recommendations.
1.Keep going and don’t change.
2. Give up and join gamblers anonymous
3. Take a look at yourself and make changes to your life, by the sound of your post, you want this, you seem passionate. It’s not impossible... but what ever you do you must take action if you want change.

Don’t let somebodys else’s opinion become your reality!

[spreadbetting]

I can see where seahorse is coming from as the stuff the OP has posted isn't really the behaviour of someone addicted to gambling. He's happy to stop when the profits gone, playing in small amounts compared to his income, only playing when bored or at a loose end etc. Just the typical behaviour of any other recreational punter.

But if someone's asking for help to stop you never really know if you're getting the full story so it's best to err on the side of caution rather than encourage him to carry on. Plus I can't see any real positives from him carrying on as his likely winnings aren't going to make any real difference to his income and the effort needed to win long term isn't something most recreational punters will ever put in.

[marketraisen]

Wow, so many posts, its very late so let me answer this line from the last one-
"quote=spreadbetting post_id=171055 time=1540156190 user_id=3492]
never really know if you're getting the full story
[/quote]

I said as much earlier but there was a time years ago that I was a degenerate compulsive gambler, which I cured the worst of by learning to win versus the old enemy.

After spending time betting just stand out odds, when removing all of my own opinions when attempting to predict the future for profit with a random punt, all large staking guesses quickly lose their appeal and the compulsive gambling behaviour that was destroying me was banished forever.

You can use any analogy where a change in conditions improves an outcome. Imagine a guy going out to sea in a sailboat and trying to move around day after day with no consideration given for the weather before hand, he goes out every day at random and simply believes with all of his will that today will be the day it works.

Suddenly out of the blue a strong breeze picks up, catches his sail and off he goes wooshing around the bay having the time of his life.
Instantly in that moment, he now knows that its not worth going out to sail unless theres a strong wind waiting, forever his random guesses in the doldrums seem stupid and not fun, it ends up the case he wont go out on the boat as much.

IF I wasnt barred from every gambling site for winning money and even betfred shops (theyre still throwing money at punters in the high street btw), I would never have started looking into trading on bf as an alternative. I dont know how accurately this is of a metric these days as they can be a bit sloppy but typically bookies dont ban degenerate losing punters, they ban people like me who were taking them for thousands.

A winning gambler can still be an addict, just because the consequences arent as destructive as the lad betting down to the change in his pocket, its still a problem. On bf as a punter I have no edge and lose, yet know enough from past wins that without an edge going full all in on pure gambling with no stops is stupid, so Im not doing that. Which is why I turned to bot building and manual trading, where I feel like I do have an edge, Im doing a couple of things Ive never seen mentioned even on these forums before and im beating commission by almost 2% on the main spreadsheet im using, over thousands of trades.

Reading the description of the recreational gambler hits home, perhaps this is what needs looked at as I dont want to be a recreational punter even. I want to win money even at the expense of 'fun', losing money in stupid ways isnt fun so I can start there..

I think I need to look at my gambling goals and whats realistic again, my plan for trading was to eventually stop betting manually totally, no matter if I failed or succeeded at trading, which clearly isnt happening as free time at home is all too often being spent following shit sports events live and guessing with money.

Im going to keep running the scripts, as I dont care ho w long it takes, I want them to build up to significant amounts and then try my hand at automating for larger liabilities, risking just the won banks. but I meed a new hobby, it has to be challenging and rewarding and unrelated to betfair, plus without the decade long losing streak before it gets interesting..!

Thank you guys for all th e replies, Im sure theres lurkers and future lurkers benefitting.

[marketraisen]

Ive pinned signs around my computer room, I have set reminders on my phone, Ive done lots of things to tell myself I am not going to piss away profits from automated trading.

What I've written on the notes-
"£3000"(my goal before upping stakes, it has to get there itself from 1k to prove its worth
"you are a sh*t guesser"
"gambling is not fun"
On another Ive written some memorable big losses from the recent past

Tonight was a test I passed, Ive just seen 4 days in a row of automation going + or - sums below £40 but today it blew up again and went +500 before the last 2 kempton races, when there was a full card of decent football that id normally go in on but I didnt do a thing, by the end of the racing I was +408. I didnt even bet the £8.

I feel like not punting was easy because of the good profit, its not an insignificant amount of money at all, the test will come when its £8 or £18 now Im trying to stop. Really just thinking about spewy bets has helped, not something Ive really done before this week.

Theres some good motivational youtube content from broke poker players crying about losses that have really helped, a big problem for decent players in that area is overstaking and being too loose with profits won playing tight, which is pretty much whats been holding me back this summer.

Im giving myself a new challenge this week, to not even check the automations progress as its ongoing through a day, I end up trying to follow races and end up refreshing bf over and over, which in the past has lead to tilting quick bets.
First 1 day, then 2 days, then 3 days etc. Its all on another computer in the other room anyway with nothing plugged into it, I never use it for anything else so it shouldnt be impossible. Ive set up mini mouse macro remotely to clear and refresh races, Ive set up excel to email me balance notifications if it hits certain loses or profits, I want to detach entirely.

If automation fails, I want to never gamble again, not even back to manual trading.

[ShaunWhite]

the test will come when its £8 or £18

The next time it's £8 or £18, take a walk down to your local food bank and ask people if they think it's a worthwhile amount of money. If you don't want it then I'm sure there's a family going through hard times or a young person who's been forced onto the streets who'll be more grateful than PaddyPower. You'll leave feeling like a winner too if you need that gratification rather than just being altrusitic.

I'll brace myself for the std torrent of derision about being 'liberal' because I dare to mention social issues in this temple to avarice.

I think I'm supposed to have 'greed is good' tattooed on my forehead to get in the club, but somehow I side-stepped the vetting process. Just a little in-joke there for Mr Ruthless-dog-eat-dog-Simon I can't remember Simon, was it Gordon Gecko or Gordon the Gopher I'm supposed to read up about ?

That's more then enough virtue signalling from me....good luck marketraisen, I hope you find a way to round down that feels more controlled, be it a hobby, the kids collage fund or charity, I'm sure the bookies will do fine without your regular donations.

[Derek27]

Gambling with money made trading, tell me how to stop this please, I need help!

.....

How the hell do I stop gambling money Ive won trading? Ive a serious problem.

Looking back on that, it's quite contradictory, because trading is gambling. You're really asking how not to lose money gambling!

What I've written on the notes-
"£3000"(my goal before upping stakes, it has to get there itself from 1k to prove its worth

You need to be clear to yourself what your goal actually is. Is it to stop gambling or is it to keep gambling until you've made £3000, and then gamble further and up stakes?

[marketraisen]

I'll brace myself for the std torrent of derision about being 'liberal' because I dare to mention social issues in this temple to avarice.

You presume too much, from the reaction of people on here to a post, all the way back to the perceived victimhood of food bank users, youre explaining yourself to a strawman.
But thank you for the well wishes regardless.

[marketraisen]

Looking back on that, it's quite contradictory, because trading is gambling. You're really asking how not to lose money gambling!

Of course it is, instead of betting on an events outcome we're placing a bet on which way a price moves.

I was just using the term trading to describe one method of gambling, which I have had success in, than the random guessing on sports, which although gambling is not backed by experience, theory or hard work and thus has a high expectation of finding a loss.

If a professional poker player lost £10 every other day on horse racing, it doesnt mean they should give up their poker career, despite both being gambling.

Ronaldo scores loads of goals but he isnt a top goalkeeper despite both being football, he should keep playing, just as a striker.

[Derek27]

If a professional poker player lost £10 every other day on horse racing, it doesnt mean they should give up their poker career, despite both being gambling.

True, but you weren't talking about losing £10 every other day betting. You were talking about blowing everything you made trading and more!

As I said earlier, whether you make money trading or working in a conventional job, if you're blowing it all betting uncontrollably, in my opinion at least, a gambling counsellor would be the best bet.

You'll get a lot of good advice on here about gambling and trading, but I doubt anyone on this forum is qualified to have a full understanding of your situation and give proper advice on what you said in your original post, is a serious problem that you need help with.

[marketraisen]

As I said earlier, whether you make money trading or working in a conventional job, if you're blowing it all betting uncontrollably, in my opinion at least, a gambling counsellor would be the best bet.

I posted my circumstances in another reply, Im not an addict in the sense its ruining my life, far from it and I shouldve used a different term to describe the behaviour. Im not scratching around for a quid to play roulette or spending 24/7 glued to betfair despite easily being able to and losing a couple of hundred isnt a big deal but still a waste. If I worked full time I'd be earning a 6 figure s salary and nobody relies on me to get destroyed gambling, even the missus pays for herself.

Somebody else pointed out the way Ive been betting is reminiscent of a recreational gambler with too much time on their hands, so thats been my jumping off point for seeking help online. Theres actually good resources out there and theres good advice for all of us out there.

[spreadbetting]

Like I said earlier I doubt you're a problem gambler as it's not affecting your life in any negative way, but I think it'll be very hard for you to quit the behaviour as there's no real need to.

I was only able to stop speculative or silly bets when my income depended on the winnings, otherwise I'd have probably carried on for the buzz gambling gives us. Very few hobbies make us money, I know plenty on here are able to do this as a hobby or part time and win by distancing themselves from the gambling side but I'm sure I couldn't do it. Takes a certain mindset to be able to put in the hours trading when you don't need the money and could probably earn more by sticking in a few hours overtime.

If you do have winning automated systems I'd try and concentrate on them by maybe looking to stick them out of the way on a VPS, so they can plod away in the background well away from temptation and then look to find a separate hobby that'll replace the adrenaline kick of gambling.

[jimibt]

.... then look to find a separate hobby that'll replace the adrenaline kick of gambling.

extreme macrame??

[Kafkaesque]

First of, I do feel a few people jumped the gun a bit with calls for you to get help. They did so though with nothing but good intentions, so by no means a critisism; just my take. I will say this though. Even if it doesn't qualify as being a problem gambler as such, since it isn't impacting your life and economy in a negative way, it's still the first step there, in gambling money you're not intending to time and again. Whether this means you should seek help, stop altogether, or keep going while trying to adjust, I don't think is for me, or anyone else as far away as an internet forum, to say. You're in such a middleground that it can only be what your own gut deep down is telling you. And not in terms of what will make you "happy" right now, but rather what will give you the most satisfaction in life long-term.

If you do keep going at it, FWIW here's my completely subjective and unscientific suggestion.

- Decide what your goal is here. And feck off with (specific) numbers! Those are nice, once they're actually in your bank account, but very much secondary at this point. Is the goal to: Prove you can beat the market/the system? Make lots of money? Make a bit of extra money?
- Make a realistic estimate of your average daily or weekly or weekly ROI on your bankroll if you only trade and don't gamble away money. Project that forward. And then do it again where you take away 50%, 75% and 90% (representing the gambling). It doesn't work for everyone, but compound interest is a huge factor and will show the witting away through gambling to be about more than the money right now. Clearly there's no guarentee that your trading can be scaled up for compound interest to work that way, so for illustration purposes only.
- Unless the above makes you hellbent on making gambling 0%, then fiddle with the numbers and decide - also based on what you came up with for the first one - which percentage you'd be okay with taking from trading profits and having a bit a gambling fun with. If you win and build, all the better. And it may just make you more selective. Should you go on and take a larger percentage away, after the original gambling percentage is gone, or even feel a strong urge to do so, then the initial question will be answered. You do have a problem and should seek help.
- Compound interest and bankroll building aside I can not speak highly enough of taking a bit of focus from the frustration of pissing it away gambling by setting an amount or percentage every month to go to one or more things. Buying records, books, going to a football match (without gambling on it, but just cause) or whatever you're into. Better yet, buy your wife a fancy dinner. Even if she's not the type to say it, if this is something you're spending your time on, care about and a part of it is eating away at you, then she's feeling it. Women tend to be bloody, annoyingly intuitive like that. She probably deserves it The dinner, not feeling your frustration
- Oh, and I'll join Shaun's liberal train of thought. Take something out every month and give to charity. However little. Along with the previous point, it'll serve as a reminder that at the end of day it's just a bit of game theory and only numbers, which happens to represent money. That in turn could, and should, make a positive impact on the life of both yourself and others, and certainly not by a cause for frustration.

[gutuami]

it is a battle between your conscious mind and a few hundred millions neurons that formed a complex link between them over the years. Trying to break that connections with a few "do this and do that" doesn't work. But the brain is flexible enough to change. So you're not doomed. Basically what you need to do is to grow a new habit as a replacement to the old one. By latest studies it takes up to 100 days for new neuronal junctions to be formed. What methods you use depends on your knowledge about yourself. One thing to remember is that if you keep doing the old things you're reinforcing the old behavior. Good luck.