The physical toll of all this....

Trading is often about how to take the appropriate risk without exposing yourself to very human flaws.
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The dog of ry
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Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:17 am

Apologies if there is already another thread on this, but I don't remember it, and couldn't seem to find anything.

I'll keep it brief.

I came from doing a fairly physical type of job. And although my bank account thanks me for downloading Bet Angel about 2 years ago, my body definitely doesn't.

I try and keep active outside of trading, and make a point of getting up and stretching every chance I can, but as they say now "sitting is the new smoking".

A recent trip to the chiropractor for lower back problems and revisiting lifting weights at the gym, I found that I've basically lost any of the core strength I had. Throw in the extra couple of kegs I'm carrying from the sedentary workday and things need to change.

Positive others have been down this path before, guess I'm just looking for advice, and maybe it'll serve as a warning to anyone starting out.

Has anybody tried sitting on fitness/swiss balls for a long time, or how about these standing desks? or in particular one I saw on here I think, that is on an angle so you're half standin half lying down? There are also these stool looking things that have padded bars around shin height to balance yourself...

Appreciate to hear any info or advice guys might have, good or bad. And apologies again if this topic has already been covered
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marksmeets302
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I tried a swiss ball, but tossed it away after a few days. It gave me problems with my shoulder (not to mention it was very uncomfortable). The reason was that with the ball, I sat too low. This gave too much stress on my shoulder.

I've never had any problems with my back, but the bench pressing in my early days has taken its toll on my shoulders. Knowing I have to be careful with them I asked an ergonomic consultant to have a look at my workplace. Turned out the height of the desk with respect to my chair and my own length was too far off. Although I'm of medium height (1.88m) I seem too need a chair with an extended gas bar (probably not the right word, I mean the vertical pole that connects the wheels and seat of the chair) and currently sit behind a desk that is adjustable in height. Really made a difference for me. I can absolutely recommend seeking help from an ergonomic expert.

Aside from that... we have to keep moving. Do sports almost every day and take the bike or walk instead of using the car. Pedometer apps on the phone are a nice way to track progress and motivate. Regarding sports: I've found it's better to do multiple kinds. Myself I do weightlifting, swimming, yoga and a little bit of running.

There's a thread on chairs here: viewtopic.php?f=41&t=6472 at around page 12.
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LeTiss
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Good post

Within 2 years of being self-employed trading, I'd put on between 3-4 stone! - I was sat down all day, pumping myself with coffee, and dunking unlimited amounts of biscuits. I couldn't be bothered to exercise anymore due to feeling shit, and I didn't have the time either, as there was always something to trade on. I wasn't simply suffering from depression.....I was loving my new job, I was just fat and out of condition

2-3 years back, I fell out of love with BF and ultimately the job too, so taking time off was a pleasure. I started running again (which I did lots of in my 20's) - this was fine initially - I lost all my weight, but now my 46 year-old knees don't agree that running is a good exercise. I walk lots, and find going for a 3-4 mile walk at 7am is the perfect start to the day - I feel fit, invigorated, and ready for the day. I've also started doing a range of Yoga/Stretching exercises at home - like you, my core was shot to bits, so whilst I don't enjoy these exercises, I feel the benefit. I also go swimming once a week

With regards to my trading set-up, I need to address this. I was more concerned about getting the right PC, desk and my quad screen set-up. I love it, but need a new chair + a standing desk may be good, as I do stand lots now to watch my screens in between placing trades

In a nutshell, this job can totally bugger your body very quickly if you don't watch out
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CaerMyrddin
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Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:47 am

Yes, important post this one.

Something that is as important as well is was you eat. Although exercise is decisive in the way you feel, if you are looking into not gaining weight, food is the key.

So seeking a nutritionist may be a good idea as well. I did so and I'm thinner now than when starting...

Glad to see you are into yoga now Darren, haven't been doing as much as I should but surely miss it. Think it's a nice way to meet people as well. Have you considered an elliptical bike, for the rainy days? It does save your knees!

In terms of ergonomics I got a simple manual, there are a lot of those around and it isn't rocket science. Just setting up the things you have properly will make a difference. Did get a higher desk in the end tough.

On a positive note, don't think this is this job problem. As far as I can see my brother in law has the same problems without the benefits, he's an IT professional. We can exercise as and when we want, there's no one else to blame if we don't. He can't! So just do it! There isn't a single market as important as your health. Move more and eat better!

Take care guys!
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Dublin_Flyer
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Agree with Marksmeets regarding the ergonomic expert, any changes will most likely be uncomfortable at first as bad habits and posture are easier to get used to than good ones.

I've a badly damaged lower back from work too, the C3-C5 discs are all degenerated and the goo that cushions them squished out so I lost 4cm height too. The MRI also showed I had a hairline crack in a vertebrae from a few years ago that repaired itself, pretty sure it was from falling out of a shopping trolley at speed around the time Jackass was popular. That's why they say don't try this at home!

One of the associated causes was much less core strength than in my 20's so it's a process of rebuilding the core strength, and loosening then building up the back muscles too. Recently I found when my back is particularly bad, some basic stretches of the hamstrings, touching the toes etc eases the pain and makes life much easier.

If you haven't had a recent MRI I'd definitely recommend one, it made it a hell of a lot easier for my physio to see what was damaged and what he was working with, it'll also spot any early signs of other problems like arthritis setting in.

Regarding activities, swimming is nearly always recommended by the health experts, suspension training like TRX can be good for all over strengthening and conditioning too and new classes seem to be popping up all over the place regularly.
andyfuller
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Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm

There are several threads on the forum about this so it is worth looking for them.

Here's my ramble...

As has been said previously, this isn't unique to your trading, it is the way of the country that as a nation we spend more and more time sat at a desk. However, we have developed over the years to do the exact opposite.

So my advice is invest in your health more than you invest in anything else. It along with time are the two most important things you have.

If you think about most people they tend to spend the vast majority of their time in 3 places; bed, sat on a sofa and sat at their desk. So invest in each of these, buy as good a mattress as you can, as good a sofa as you can and as good a desk set up as you can. If you can't afford all at once try to prioritise and then build out as budget allows.

In terms of health, build that into your daily routine, your future self will thank you for it both physically and mentally.

My advice is do not buy home gym equipment, join a gym. Book yourself on to classes as that gives you a reason to go, but also by joining a gym you get out and meet people - something which you don't do while sat behind your desk.

Consider getting yourself a dog - it will make you get out everyday a few times as you have to walk it - again see it as an investment in your health with the added bonus of it being a family pet.

From my own view point, I have never been fitter and find that the benefit of working for myself allows me to do a lot more sport than I ever could in a regular job. I do classes at my gym, such as HIIT, Bodypump, Insanity. I am a member of the squash league which forces me to play games, not that I struggle to play most weeks. I also run and by signing up to races I force myself to have to train, I find if I don't have a target I don't motivate myself to go out running.

On more easy everyday points, only fill your glass of water half way so you run out quicker and have to get up and fill it more often, only use the toilet on a different floor to where you trade so you get up and go up and down stairs. Set a timer for say every 15 mins and get up each time and walk down stairs.

The vast majority of it comes down to self motivation and finding what motivates you and putting steps in place to make you do it and eventually it becomes part of your routine.

Also cut out eating all the rubbish, the easiest way is to not buy it in the first place, for example I don't buy crisps - I love them but if they are in the house I will eat them. Instead I buy a bag of apples and half one instead. I don't buy squash etc anymore - I just drink water. At first I didn't particularly like it but now it is ingrained in me and I would much sooner a cold glass of water than a fizzy drink.

Don't try and make all the changes at once as it will become unachieveable and you will feel down hearted and likely stop but do them gradually and reward yourself from time to time - I had a lovely kebab on Saturday ;)

But remember the only thing to blame for your current set of circumstances is yourself and it is only you that can make the changes despite what we all write.

Good luck as at first it probably will feel tough but in time you will feel much better for it and your future self will thank you for it when you are healthy as opposed to suffering from heart disease!

Keep us posted on your progress over the coming months - now put that chocolate biscuit down and go for a walk!
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Euler
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Location: Bet Angel HQ

I was going to post, but I think my opinion would be a mixture of all of the above. Lots of sensible words in here. But I lost my core strength and let things slip before waking up and taking up mountain biking, which I enjoy a lot. I can't really run any longer.

It's worth investing your time in healthy living as it will pay you back dividends. I still have some work to do as I work too hard still.
The dog of ry
Posts: 262
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:17 am

Thanks for the replies, I was fairly sure others would have some nuggets of knowledge.

Have moved into a new place, and can see a Pilates Studio out one window, and Yoga out another. I've been toying with the idea, and you guys have swayed me to give Yoga a try. I have no real idea what to expect, other than it'll probably prove how inflexible I've become :o

Cracking idea about the Ergo Expert too, I will speak to my chiro about that this afternoon. Probably due for an office upgrade
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Grinderman
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I had an office job for years before going full time on Betfair. Slouching about on their crap office chair screwed my lower back. A minor op a few years ago didn't cure it. However, buying a fantastic chair for my home office is a big help. I am lucky, probably a stone lighter now. I walk to the pub most evenings to keep fit.
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Dallas
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My youngest just told me about these which i'de never heard of, seems their all the rage with gamers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-loMUL3_-b0

Or you can op for something to go with your current desk, which i think i will be going for myself.
http://uk.varidesk.com/

Great thread btw :)
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jimibt
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Location: Narnia

Dallas wrote:My youngest just told me about these which i'de never heard of, seems their all the rage with gamers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-loMUL3_-b0

Or you can op for something to go with your current desk, which i think i will be going for myself.
http://uk.varidesk.com/

Great thread btw :)
apart from looking quite ugly, that varidesk is a brilliant solution to a common problem of wanting to stand to do some work but not being able to, due to the fixed desk scenario... love this and will see if they have something less industrial looking myself....
andyfuller
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Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm

Dallas wrote:My youngest just told me about these which i'de never heard of, seems their all the rage with gamers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-loMUL3_-b0

Or you can op for something to go with your current desk, which i think i will be going for myself.
http://uk.varidesk.com/

Great thread btw :)
when you look around on Youtube there are some pretty awesome gaming setups people have.

Could you do me a favour and ask your son if he knows where you can source these gaming desks in the UK that are motorised.

I have been in the market for a motorised desk now for a while and I am really struggling to find one that will do what I want that is supplied in the UK. In the US there are loads of suppliers of them but as yet I have been unable to find one that will supply to the UK.

In the UK we seem to have only the poor mans options really which mainly consist of the sort that you place on top of your existing desk such as this one:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sit-stand-Work ... 015E70EV8/

Ergotron do a range of desks but their only motorised version of a standing desk, the Elevate, doesn't seem available anywhere in the UK. The best they offer to us in the UK is the WorkFit-D or B. Personally I would get the B so I could fit my own desktop to the frame. But this version isn't motorised and I would soon find it annoying trying to get it to the exact height I would want. Hence why I want a motorised one that you can pre-program with defined heights so that you get the correct height everytime.

Products: http://www.ergotron.com/portals/0/html/ ... esks3.html

Review of Workfit-D: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU4-DLPi0nQ


Apex in the US do a good such desk at a reasonable price:

Product: https://www.amazon.com/ApexDesk-Electri ... B00WL75G3G

Youtube review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDdh5RVIfzk


This is also a very good review of the UpDesk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qYw8naMBgA


The only real option I have found so far in terms of motorised desk is from our good friends in Sweden, Ikea. They offer us this range of standing desks at their usual reasonable price points with also the option of a hand cranked desk for under £200. The only thing stopping me going for their desk is that you can't save set heights:

Products: http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/ikea/campaign ... ing-desks/

Review (Wait until 2mins 20secs for the surprise under his desk :shock: ): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSsKpWAIJGQ


Finally as a pet hate of mine is cables going everywhere can I highly recommend people buy themselves some of these for a few quid and a roll of velcro so you can cut straps to use instead of cable ties allowing easy swapping out of cables in the future:

Cable tie mounts (you can get stick on instead of screw): https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007JVWF38/
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Crazyskier
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Grinderman wrote:I walk to the pub most evenings to keep fit.
Had to chuckle to myself at this!
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Grinderman
Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2015 2:44 pm

Just off for my daily workout.
dannycutts
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Location: West Sussex

I have been working from home for about 10 years now and a desk is crucial... I also tend to not work the summer as well which helps :D

Standing is a great way to work and also keeps you awake and more alert but dont lock your knees :D
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