Gambling Ethics

Trading is often about how to take the appropriate risk without exposing yourself to very human flaws.
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megarain
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This is a topic I often think about (sad life, I know)

This v well written article, about collusion at a final Table (poker), has given me the final push to add stuff to the mix.

This is the article.. which is v worthy.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/10Ai ... sp=sharing

My angle is this :

If I like Team A, and make them a 1.6 chance. I would normally have say £100 on them, but they are 1.8.

Is it wrong, to have £500 on them, advise others on social
Media, and reduce my exposure to £100, when the herd back them ?
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wearthefoxhat
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Justin Bonomo is worth listening to for sure. Being able to see the cards and the softer play, provides the evidence needed for futher discussion. The guy in 3rd must have realised he was on a hiding to nothing!

The players that swop % of each other or stake other players are very likely to find themselves playing a hand against them at some time in a tournament. It must be true, that how they play, is impacted in some way. Any poker tournament player that knows other players well, maybe good friends with some, will have experienced it at some level.

When I played the european circuit, back in the day, I'd bump into "teams" of other players that would clearly play softer against each other. They would have interests and motivation in a tournament win as they could then gain a better sponsorship deal. The Hendon Mob were one of them. Very likeable guys for sure, despite their "we always play hard against each other," philosophy, it wasn't true, in bigger, higher profile events.

Even in local card-rooms for smaller buy ins, it's fairly easy to spot the groups that know each other. My best results are when I attend on my own and take no prisoners, but will accept a prize deal if I sense softer play from the remaining players...assuming I last that long of course.
stueytrader
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I used to play a fair bit of poker at Skypoker. For any that know of that place you would know of the friendly and social aspects of that pool of players - many meet in person as well as playing together online.

I suspected there was a lot of friendly groups playing the online Double-your-money games on there. They'd deny playing soft of course, but when all three mates can cash together, nuff said really. I left them to it after a while, mugs game playing against any groups.

Whether this is all ethical is a pretty grey area IMO.

Though I think the initial suggestion in a trading sense is slightly different, I don't see anyone being deliberately beaten, unlike in poker collusion, where others definitely lose due to it.
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Global1st
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That game was crazy. Sometimes I look at how real professional play poker and understand that it is really very different from how I play. And it brings me back on the earth. There are a lot of things I have to learn to play poker professionally. I am playing poker for money and I often win, so I consider myself a good player, but damn, I don`t have any chances in professional tournaments. I am now learning and improving my skills. I am looking forward to playing better.
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wearthefoxhat
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Global1st wrote:
Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:18 pm
That game was crazy. Sometimes I look at how real professional play poker and understand that it is really very different from how I play. And it brings me back on the earth. There are a lot of things I have to learn to play poker professionally. I am playing poker for money and I often win, so I consider myself a good player, but damn, I don`t have any chances in professional tournaments. I am now learning and improving my skills. I am looking forward to playing better.
On-line, ideally for smaller stakes is a good way to go. It keeps expenses down and saves all that travelling to casino card rooms. Yep, never stop learning as No Limit has not yet been solved, unlike Limit poker.

In the UK, we are fortunate that gaming/gambling is tolerated better that other parts of europe.
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johnsheppard
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megarain wrote:
Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:28 am
If I like Team A, and make them a 1.6 chance. I would normally have say £100 on them, but they are 1.8.

Is it wrong, to have £500 on them, advise others on social
Media, and reduce my exposure to £100, when the herd back them ?
I think ethics gets pretty complicated. But there are two ways of judging ethics...by intention or by consequence...

By intent, In the above example, things appear to me to be unethical. Your intent for advising others on social media is for personal profit (i.e. loading more than you would normally place for the purposes of trading out). It's a little grey, because your intent is also for their benefit...I would think for it to be ethical, you'd have to state on social media something like...Back at 1.8, lay at 1.6...because that's your plan...

By consequence, depends on if Team A wins or lose and the corresponding causation you've unleashed on the lives of people who are influenced by your social media :) You;d probably wanna prefix your social media posts with some disclaimer in order to be more ethical...but your problem in this instance, is that some people are stupid....(and they must be catered for)...so that disclaimer could get real long...
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megarain
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Thx for the reply.

In the 18 mths since the original post, my thoughts actually havent changed that much, but the social media space has
definately got more crowded. I tend to think if the crowd are getting above the right price .. in this case 1.60, its ok.

I am not picking on anyone, but now often see tweets from our host - which have definately increased in the last year.
BA twitter.jpg
I am not sure what impact it has. e.g.

This is just one example which happened to go on and win. There have been many times I have seen tweets which were correct, and the price reverted or the thing lost. I haven't kept track, but think the BA twitter has been 'right' far many more times, than 'wrong'.

Its a v grey area .. just 'maybe' increasing awareness/reach.

I am now less engaged, as just havent the time - see so much wrong, that its impossible to keep up.

Will make a good question one day on a gambling exam paper.
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johnsheppard
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Whoops didn't realise it was an 18month old thread :) I tend to click on the new posts link every day and read through. The ethics of things I get excited about for some reason and had time to think about it, so added my 2cents....

I've never used twitter, perhaps I would do well to watch the betangel tweets...might learn something...but on the other hand, ones own data and schemes are more replicable...probably better to focus on that...but that's a different subject...

The ethics thing I think its a case of if you're into utilitarianism, gambling becomes a bit of a problem...for mine I lean towards deontoligical (intent), just because it's a bit more practical... I haven't thought it through but I would suspect you end up analysing determinism and freewill and all that jazz in order to really figure out ethics...
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