Ah, I know that feeling... no cure for that...
What, if anything, tempts you into reckless behaviour?
In the settings menu hide the balance - simples as long as you don't peekFrogThimble wrote: ↑Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:16 pmI've noticed one dangerous trait in my own trading behaviour. It seems that, psychologically, I am willing to accept any loss on any trade except for a loss that more than wipes out the day's profits so far. When that happens I tend to get frustrated and either up my stakes or try a full on gamble in the next event.
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- Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:26 pm
I'd still be doing the mental arithmetic though.foxwood wrote: ↑Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:13 pmIn the settings menu hide the balance - simples as long as you don't peekFrogThimble wrote: ↑Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:16 pmI've noticed one dangerous trait in my own trading behaviour. It seems that, psychologically, I am willing to accept any loss on any trade except for a loss that more than wipes out the day's profits so far. When that happens I tend to get frustrated and either up my stakes or try a full on gamble in the next event.
when you make a cock up and you're feeling frustrated just open sound recorder and record a message for 'future you'. And next time when you are tempted to misbehave just listen to your message from the past. And ask yourself - why did I record this message? should I listen to this younger version of me or not. and so on....
That is a really good idea.gutuami wrote: ↑Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:17 amwhen you make a cock up and you're feeling frustrated just open sound recorder and record a message for 'future you'. And next time when you are tempted to misbehave just listen to your message from the past. And ask yourself - why did I record this message? should I listen to this younger version of me or not. and so on....
By far the reason for reckless behaviour for me is the inability to accept a loss at 3-4 ticks which goes to 7-10 ticks. Then, I let the race go in play with 20+ times more risk than the original 3-4 risk control.
Letting the race go in play is the road to ruin for 99% of traders. Easier long term to take the 4 tick loss and try to recover later on in the day.
A feature I've recently found (via Peter's Videos) is the cancel button at the top of the ladder can be highlighted to make you aware you have money in the market you may not be aware of. This is a fantastic addition, thanks Peter.
- SeaHorseRacing
- Posts: 2893
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 7:06 pm
If I used to have a bad day.. I would start betting on horses.
How did I overcome that?
Stop looking at my trading balance and told myself a million times. Do the trade and move on.
I had a little card...
Which read as such..
I am so happy and grateful that I do not act recklessly if I have a losing trade.
I would read this on every race/market I opened and after I finished each trade
I also took the profit and loss column out of the ladder. Worked wonders.
Eventually you develop a new habit. It’s the repitition that changes you. I did this every day for every trade and it took a good 8 months to really start to work.
I had other things listed on my paradigm card but I probably read it 100,000 times.
I have done a lot of research into gamblers and physchology and I still continuously research it and it is very true that even for compulsive gamblers. If you assessed the risk before everything you did you would never do those things.
For example: compulsive gamblers are only them because they fail to accept there out come or even think of it.
Teach yourself the risk before you place the trade. Not just money terms.
Before each market, if you tell yourself that a loss of say of £50 is likely to get you to behave recklessly you’ve already given yourself a reminder. So when your in a £40 loss your brain now remembers. It’s now time to get out. When your in the moment it can be impossible to think this way but by preparing before so it can really change you.
Pressurising yourself to make money- just as bad.
You need to take opportunities in trading. Not trying to make them. For me another game changer.
Take each market as it comes and take what you can not what you’d like.
How did I overcome that?
Stop looking at my trading balance and told myself a million times. Do the trade and move on.
I had a little card...
Which read as such..
I am so happy and grateful that I do not act recklessly if I have a losing trade.
I would read this on every race/market I opened and after I finished each trade
I also took the profit and loss column out of the ladder. Worked wonders.
Eventually you develop a new habit. It’s the repitition that changes you. I did this every day for every trade and it took a good 8 months to really start to work.
I had other things listed on my paradigm card but I probably read it 100,000 times.
I have done a lot of research into gamblers and physchology and I still continuously research it and it is very true that even for compulsive gamblers. If you assessed the risk before everything you did you would never do those things.
For example: compulsive gamblers are only them because they fail to accept there out come or even think of it.
Teach yourself the risk before you place the trade. Not just money terms.
Before each market, if you tell yourself that a loss of say of £50 is likely to get you to behave recklessly you’ve already given yourself a reminder. So when your in a £40 loss your brain now remembers. It’s now time to get out. When your in the moment it can be impossible to think this way but by preparing before so it can really change you.
Pressurising yourself to make money- just as bad.
You need to take opportunities in trading. Not trying to make them. For me another game changer.
Take each market as it comes and take what you can not what you’d like.
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- Posts: 124
- Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:26 pm
All of my trades are in-play. So not going in-play isn't an option for me.xtrader16 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:49 am
By far the reason for reckless behaviour for me is the inability to accept a loss at 3-4 ticks which goes to 7-10 ticks. Then, I let the race go in play with 20+ times more risk than the original 3-4 risk control.
Letting the race go in play is the road to ruin for 99% of traders. Easier long term to take the 4 tick loss and try to recover later on in the day.
A feature I've recently found (via Peter's Videos) is the cancel button at the top of the ladder can be highlighted to make you aware you have money in the market you may not be aware of. This is a fantastic addition, thanks Peter.
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- Posts: 124
- Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:26 pm
That's a great idea. I think I'll print something like that out for myself. As it happens I've just had a losing trade again of the kind that made me behave badly yesterday (took out the day's profits)... but I'm behaving myself this time and made a sensible normal trade on the next race.SeaHorseRacing wrote: ↑Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:04 amIf I used to have a bad day.. I would start betting on horses.
How did I overcome that?
Stop looking at my trading balance and told myself a million times. Do the trade and move on.
I had a little card...
Which read as such..
I am so happy and grateful that I do not act recklessly if I have a losing trade.
I would read this on every race/market I opened and after I finished each trade
- ShaunWhite
- Posts: 9731
- Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am
Preconditioning is fine but the triggers happen in the heat of the moment. The nature of the scenario means that you aren't going to stop and read notes or listen to recordings before you do something you shouldn't. If you had the presence of mind to do that you'd also be compos mentis enough to stick to your strategy.
But 3 practical tips.
Automation : If you have a maximum loss in mind (2%?) then just run a bot that closes the trade and locks you out for the rest of the race. That will give you a minute or two for the red mist to fade. Better still run that on a laptop in another room under a pile of books locked with a password only your partner knows.
Precocndioning: Screen print the huge losses and the big but OK losses. Look at them before a session and condition yourself to seeing the big but OK ones as being a hell of a lot better than the huge ones. Remember how each felt at the time. Remember how good taking the 'correct' loss felt by the end of the day.
In the moment: When you're looking at a £50 loss that should have been 10. Instead of letting your £200 stake ride on it now for a quick fix, tell yourself that you're going to find a good thing later and have £20 quid on it. Why risk and extra 150 when 20 should be enough. You'll wipe out the loss no problem. Chimp brain will like that idea. BUT and here's the essential part...by the time that good thing comes around you should be focused enough again to not actually do it. If you still do it once you've had a cuppa and calmed down, then you seriously need to think about whether this style of trading is your thing.
Having said all of the above I have to also say I'm a pretty bad cold ladder trader, 50yrs of being impulsive is bloody difficult to change. That's why I'm looking elsewhere more now at things that suit my nature more. You don't have to be a steady Eddie to ladder trade, but if you're not one naturally then you certainly need to act like one for hours on end, that's not easy if your default wiring just isn't like that. There's enough types of trading to try without getting bogged down by one style if it's not working out for you.
But 3 practical tips.
Automation : If you have a maximum loss in mind (2%?) then just run a bot that closes the trade and locks you out for the rest of the race. That will give you a minute or two for the red mist to fade. Better still run that on a laptop in another room under a pile of books locked with a password only your partner knows.
Precocndioning: Screen print the huge losses and the big but OK losses. Look at them before a session and condition yourself to seeing the big but OK ones as being a hell of a lot better than the huge ones. Remember how each felt at the time. Remember how good taking the 'correct' loss felt by the end of the day.
In the moment: When you're looking at a £50 loss that should have been 10. Instead of letting your £200 stake ride on it now for a quick fix, tell yourself that you're going to find a good thing later and have £20 quid on it. Why risk and extra 150 when 20 should be enough. You'll wipe out the loss no problem. Chimp brain will like that idea. BUT and here's the essential part...by the time that good thing comes around you should be focused enough again to not actually do it. If you still do it once you've had a cuppa and calmed down, then you seriously need to think about whether this style of trading is your thing.
Having said all of the above I have to also say I'm a pretty bad cold ladder trader, 50yrs of being impulsive is bloody difficult to change. That's why I'm looking elsewhere more now at things that suit my nature more. You don't have to be a steady Eddie to ladder trade, but if you're not one naturally then you certainly need to act like one for hours on end, that's not easy if your default wiring just isn't like that. There's enough types of trading to try without getting bogged down by one style if it's not working out for you.