Close trade on selection with greening - Max liability

[Vovsen]

Hi

I have a "Close trade on selection with greening" rule which triggers twice.

I only want it to trigger the 2nd time if the first trigger did not get fully matched.

However it seems that when it triggers the 2nd time, it does not actually green up - it places or tries to place a straight up lay bet instead which, sometimes exceed my max liability settings and put me at risk of losing my entire bank.

Can anyone recommend how to have multiple green up rules, that are safeguarded in a way so it will only ever green up and never place a straight up lay bet?

It does not seem to happen when i use "Green all selection", but I would like to have both running (at different times)

[Dallas]

Once a selection has been greened up it won't place another bet (it will trigger but the stake required would be £0 so nothing would be placed)

If in-play Sounds like you might be triggering to quick and not waiting for the first to arrive in the market
Or your closing trades on selections already at 1000.0 so are possible getting a whole £2 attemped to be placed (if your green up bet now required a stake of <£2).

If its the later in your main settings area on the 'green up' tab you can tell it to only trigger if a selections price is less than 'X'

[Vovsen]

Once a selection has been greened up it won't place another bet (it will trigger but the stake required would be £0 so nothing would be placed)

It triggers, but it does not say the stake required would be £0. The log says for example:

"Placing £1000 Lay bet with greening at 7." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".
Or
"Placing £10 Lay bet with greening at 100." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".

I am sort of nervous now actually cause mine does not say 0. Does that still mean it will not actually place a £1000 lay bet if I increase my liability setting?

If its the later in your main settings area on the 'green up' tab you can tell it to only trigger if a selections price is less than 'X'

I would like it to always trigger the green up, no matter which price or liability it is.
At the same time, I want my Max liability setting to be £100 when placing manual or automatic bets
(So that greening up is not prevented due to the Max Libility setting being too low)

But this does not seem to be possible from what I understand?

[LeeCaL]

Hi

I have a "Close trade on selection with greening" rule which triggers twice.

I only want it to trigger the 2nd time if the first trigger did not get fully matched.

However it seems that when it triggers the 2nd time, it does not actually green up - it places or tries to place a straight up lay bet instead which, sometimes exceed my max liability settings and put me at risk of losing my entire bank.

Can anyone recommend how to have multiple green up rules, that are safeguarded in a way so it will only ever green up and never place a straight up lay bet?

It does not seem to happen when i use "Green all selection", but I would like to have both running (at different times)

Can I ask how long have you set to re-arm the trigger?
As Dallas said, you need to allow time for the first green up to enter the market or the second trigger will fire before the original bet has entered the market causing a double bet.

As a guide I usually allow the rule to trigger 3 times with a re-arm time of 30secs which is enough time for the matches with the longest bet delays to enter the market.

Hope this helps

[Vovsen]

Can I ask how long have you set to re-arm the trigger?

Hi Lee, thanks for the input. Re-arm is set to 5 seconds, but the conditions usually make it re-trigger longer out than 5 seconds.

This is only for pre-racing, not inplay, so bet delays is not an issue.

The main issue is automatic greening conflicting with the max liability setting
The secondary issue is automatic greening sometime turning into a bet when it should be greening

[Dallas]

Once a selection has been greened up it won't place another bet (it will trigger but the stake required would be £0 so nothing would be placed)

It triggers, but it does not say the stake required would be £0. The log says for example:

"Placing £1000 Lay bet with greening at 7." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".
Or
"Placing £10 Lay bet with greening at 100." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".

I am sort of nervous now actually cause mine does not say 0. Does that still mean it will not actually place a £1000 lay bet if I increase my liability setting?

If its the later in your main settings area on the 'green up' tab you can tell it to only trigger if a selections price is less than 'X'

I would like it to always trigger the green up, no matter which price or liability it is.
At the same time, I want my Max liability setting to be £100 when placing manual or automatic bets
(So that greening up is not prevented due to the Max Libility setting being too low)

But this does not seem to be possible from what I understand?

If it triggers and places a bet it means it 'hasn't' yet greened up.
If it had already greened up as per my message above it would still trigger again and the number of triggers would still increment to show this but no bets would be placed and therefore nothing would be writen to your log

A greening bet is just a back or lay bet calculated by the software to exit your position, so the 'Max Liability' setting will cover all bets no matter how or for what reason they are placed
So you'd need to ensure this is set high enough to allow you to exit any position you might want to close
ie, if you set it to max liability £500
then back something at 2.0 for £5, but want to close the trade just by laying at odds of 200.0 the liability from that bet is £995 and well above your specified maximum

[Vovsen]

Once a selection has been greened up it won't place another bet (it will trigger but the stake required would be £0 so nothing would be placed)

It triggers, but it does not say the stake required would be £0. The log says for example:

"Placing £1000 Lay bet with greening at 7." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".
Or
"Placing £10 Lay bet with greening at 100." and then "This would exceed your maximum liability setting".

I am sort of nervous now actually cause mine does not say 0. Does that still mean it will not actually place a £1000 lay bet if I increase my liability setting?

If its the later in your main settings area on the 'green up' tab you can tell it to only trigger if a selections price is less than 'X'

I would like it to always trigger the green up, no matter which price or liability it is.
At the same time, I want my Max liability setting to be £100 when placing manual or automatic bets
(So that greening up is not prevented due to the Max Libility setting being too low)

But this does not seem to be possible from what I understand?

If it triggers and places a bet it means it 'hasn't' yet greened up.
If it had already greened up as per my message above it would still trigger again and the number of triggers would still increment to show this but no bets would be placed and therefore nothing would be writen to your log

A greening bet is just a back or lay bet calculated by the software to exit your position, so the 'Max Liability' setting will cover all bets no matter how or for what reason they are placed
So you'd need to ensure this is set high enough to allow you to exit any position you might want to close
ie, if you set it to max liability £500
then back something at 2.0 for £5, but want to close the trade just by laying at odds of 200.0 the liability from that bet is £995 and well above your specified maximum

Thanks a bunch for input and confirming Dallas

I made a suggestion based on this

[Vovsen]

Once a selection has been greened up it won't place another bet (it will trigger but the stake required would be £0 so nothing would be placed)

Hi again Dallas,

Today I encountered the issue again. This was pre race in the last minute and my refresh rate is 20 ms.

It should not place another bet but it does, maybe once per month. I have over hundreds of markets a month where it is working fine, without any issues.

When it happens, I have only opened the market in a New ladder window, sometimes I drag the selection icon and other times i just drag the market from Guardian.

I see my first green up being triggered, it gets matched, and then 3 seconds later it triggers the next green up, but that becomes a bet.

Here are my Green up settings

GreenUpSettings.PNG

And here is the log

09/09/2020 06:21:14: [G_Auto] : € 4.32 Back bet placed on A Go Go at 11.5. € 1.46 matched at 11.5 € 2.86 unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 210636698670 ( Fill or kill bet with 0.02 seconds delay. )
09/09/2020 06:21:14: [G_Auto] : € 4.44089209850063E-16 of unmatched bet (Ref:210636698670) was filled before remainder was killed.
09/09/2020 16:59:19: [G_Auto] : Greened up A Go Go by Laying 2.33 at 7.2
09/09/2020 16:59:23: [G_Auto] : Greened up A Go Go by Laying 2.27 at 7.4

GreenUpKickoff.PNG

InplayBet.PNG

I had to manually green up, to prevent the bet from going inplay

09/09/2020 17:00:00: Greened up A Go Go by Backing 2.40 at 6.8
09/09/2020 17:00:57: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended
09/09/2020 17:00:59: Guardian has detected that the market is in-play
09/09/2020 17:00:59: Guardian has detected that the market is now unsuspended
09/09/2020 17:01:59: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended



It does not make sense to me, because I see it working fine on so many markets, but could it have something to do with the green up settings and me opening a ladder window perhaps, or the way that I open the ladder window that conflicts with the green up settings.

Is there a work around solution that could get around the issue?

Would it work to also have an automation rule that cancels all unmatched bets after greening up has triggered? It does not seem like it because it is not about unmatched bets, but about the green up rule not recognizing that is actually executing a bet, instead of greening up.

Or is there perhaps an error where because the first bet did not get fully filled the first time, and so it tries to green up for the wrong amount/net stake.

[Vovsen]

I just found this from an old post - am I misunderstanding or does Fill/Kill impact the green up, so the green all does not register the initial lay stake correctly, and thus places a bet instead of greening?

Thanks Dallas, the info above is very useful. Especially setting the rearm time to greater than the set delay One last thing, does Betangel fill or kill unmatched greening up bets or does it know to differentiate normal bets from greening up ones?

No, effectively a greening up bet is a 'normal' bet just calculated by the software to spread out any P/L
The fill/kill option can't be used with a 'greening up' bet but within your main settings you can instruct the software to cancel unmatched bets including the previous green up order

Or maybe it is because I am using the new ANY selection with the rule type "Green All Selections" - is that not supposed to work? I get a message saying it cant be used for EVERY, but not for ANY