This sounds more like people thinking that they're experts or intellectuals rather than in actuality. I find the most intellectual people are those that accept what it is that they don't know, that recognise the grey areas, the assumptions, the bias that's inherent in their understanding.Euler wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:46 pmSome of the worst pre-off racing traders I know are highly knowledgable on racing.
When I would run courses I would describe what I saw in the market...
I'd say something, this horse is getting a lot of backing support so I'll back it looking for it to shorten.
The very knowledge types would pipe up with something like... But that makes no sense it's going to lose! Out would come various reasons why it couldn't win. They couldn't go against that instinct.
But it's the same with people who are too intellectual, they can't take the risk, they over qualify everything. I'm surprised they have ever crossed a road!
Trading What I see !?
That would entirely depend on whether you believe a public forum should be a good place for serious trading discussions
darchas wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 11:13 pmThis sounds more like people thinking that they're experts or intellectuals rather than in actuality. I find the most intellectual people are those that accept what it is that they don't know, that recognise the grey areas, the assumptions, the bias that's inherent in their understanding.Euler wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:46 pmSome of the worst pre-off racing traders I know are highly knowledgable on racing.
When I would run courses I would describe what I saw in the market...
I'd say something, this horse is getting a lot of backing support so I'll back it looking for it to shorten.
The very knowledge types would pipe up with something like... But that makes no sense it's going to lose! Out would come various reasons why it couldn't win. They couldn't go against that instinct.
But it's the same with people who are too intellectual, they can't take the risk, they over qualify everything. I'm surprised they have ever crossed a road!
Well I said I wouldn't post on this again but hey...maybe just one more. This post pretty much nails it. A true intellectual is an exceptionally learned person and in the process achieves wisdom not just from what they know but develop a sort of "feel" for what they don't and it's this that is hard to explain or develop. People confuse "intellectuals" with "academics" IMO ,
People who go to Uni are examples of the latter and I know many...unfortunately many of them dont have wisdom and are not and probably never will be intellectuals.
What you need is a combination of emotional and intellectual intelligence. Not one or the other.
You can see the problem clearly on social media and betting markets.
Emotionally driven types love the quick smash and grab fast buck things. Pure intellectuals will tell you why it can't be done.
But you need some intellect to work out what to really do, but you also need that decisive nature to do it.
I've had run-ins at both ends. Both of which fight their corner to prove they are right, but ultimately both are wrong as neither of them listen.
You can see the problem clearly on social media and betting markets.
Emotionally driven types love the quick smash and grab fast buck things. Pure intellectuals will tell you why it can't be done.
But you need some intellect to work out what to really do, but you also need that decisive nature to do it.
I've had run-ins at both ends. Both of which fight their corner to prove they are right, but ultimately both are wrong as neither of them listen.
Which is entirely as expected. When's the last time anyone you know said...."That fundamentally held belief I've had all my life was wrong. I'm going to change my mind on the matter."
It just doesn't happen. It's more about ego than intellect or emotion. Even when you categorically prove to someone they were wrong, they either try to justify their error or else point the finger at someone else.
what I will say is that you learn a heck of a lot just by watching horse racing markets, pretty much what I’m doing this afternoon, recording them is great but for some reason I tend to take more notice of watching them live, without participating a couple of times I would have entered a position only for it to turn against me, by watching hopefully will give me a better understanding as to what happened
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spreadbetting
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Why not simply watch the prices and see how they behave, the amounts of money at each price point can be very confusing and can appear/disappear in seconds. Most of us are simply following prices in and out, the more you watch, the more you'll be able to spot genuine moves or when money has dried up and prices will back out again. Charts aren't going to help you with that.
Thanks that sounds genuinely helpful, cheersspreadbetting wrote: ↑Tue Oct 27, 2020 3:30 pmWhy not simply watch the prices and see how they behave, the amounts of money at each price point can be very confusing and can appear/disappear in seconds. Most of us are simply following prices in and out, the more you watch, the more you'll be able to spot genuine moves or when money has dried up and prices will back out again. Charts aren't going to help you with that.
Euler wrote: ↑Tue Oct 27, 2020 10:43 amWhat you need is a combination of emotional and intellectual intelligence. Not one or the other.
You can see the problem clearly on social media and betting markets.
Emotionally driven types love the quick smash and grab fast buck things. Pure intellectuals will tell you why it can't be done.
But you need some intellect to work out what to really do, but you also need that decisive nature to do it.
I've had run-ins at both ends. Both of which fight their corner to prove they are right, but ultimately both are wrong as neither of them listen.
Sorry to post again when I said I wouldn't but this topic fascinates me Peter. You are perfectly correct because you do need a balance of emotional and intellectual intelligence and an imbalance would be bad within a trading environment. The betting industry derives a huge revenue stream from emotionally driven betting especially spread markets and anything in play.
But here we have the key point as to the definitive meaning of the term "intellectual" because this conversation reminds me of the age old "book smart" vs "street smart" argument which IMO is too generic an argument. A true "intellectual" isn't someone who is just "book smart". A person who is "book smart" may have no practical experience of something and make horrendous errors not just in trading but in life. A medical student straight out of Uni would be an example although that's a rough analogy.
While it most certainly does require an "intellect" to figure out the right way forward and to solve the problems and while some people may be indecisive, indecisiveness can be solved by education. A learner driver would be indecisive (if they had any sense) during their first month behind a wheel but not so after two years. But an "intellectual" would solve the problems that were presented to them because true intellectuals perceive what they don't know as well as what they do and where they are falling short.
Scientists for example like Lawrence Krauss are intellectuals but that isn't because they are scientists or book smarts or very intelligent (even though they are)....it is because they are very smart problem solvers and simply think on a higher level but they don't think on a higher level because of book learning. Being intellectual directed them to increase their learning because through wisdom or higher intellect or whatever you want to call it, they accurately deduced that there was a lot more to know than they already knew. I actually dug deep into this subject a few years ago because of its relevance to risk markets and the areas that I was actively involved in a risk capacity so that is why it is such a fascinating topic for me...which you can tell lol
There is no binary outcome with this and no "right or wrong" as you correctly say and if anyone fights their argument too much well then they aren't being overly scientific and are probably not science literate and are certainly not "intellectual". Because you need to be very careful in how aggressively you fight your corner unless it is something which is undisputable because this time next year you could be totally wrong if you were ever right in the first place
Stop posting anymore on this subject and distracting me
Probably deserves a separate thread TBH.Stop posting anymore on this subject and distracting me
It was a bit of a breakthrough moment for me which is why I'll often join in on these debates.
I've loads of examples of people on either end of the spectrum that led me to realise there was probably an edge in the way you thought. But it requires going against the norms, which is why few can really pull it off.
But it's incredibly enlightening when you can do it.