Stable Scalping Guardian Automation Bot for Horse Racing

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Dallas
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duggs wrote:Unfortunately the results from day one are not that good i played to £5 stakes and the results are as follows -£2.40 -30p +£2.70 -35p -70p -59p so only a couple pound lost for the last race i played around with the paramaters to double the times so 20sec 1min and 2min i reduced the stakes to £1 however i lost £1 on this race so if i bet £5 i would have lost £5 so that did not work

IMHO the SP possibly needs to be reduced because there are too many bets nearly 100 for the champion hurdle.

however my main observation is that i am nearly always left with with 3 or 4 Back Bets unmatched which is probably why this does bot does not make a profit the lay bets have a 2 tick stop loss why does have the Back Bet have a similar condition ?

I appreciate all your hard work Dallas you are the best, i am a newbie and only beginning to learn about automation however if i was writing a scalping bot, I have tried but dont know how to trigger the lay bet so not sure if possible but if so it would be something like this

If Price is stable (eg 10 secs 20 secs 60 secs) Back at best reverse price (ie the current lay price)
If Back bet is matched place lay bet at best reverse price (ie the current back price) with a stop loss of 2 ticks if the market moves against you

so for an example Horse 1 price available is Back 3.7 Lay 3.8 we will try to back at 3.8 and lay 3.7 hence make a small profit
These bots are shared as a starting point for new users to automation for them to build on or draw idea's from - applied as they are is highly unlikely to return a long term profit and if any did it would soon stop once everyone downloaded it and started using it.

It already backs and lays at the best reverse price as you have suggested but its there to be fully edited and used as you see fit
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Euler
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duggs wrote:Not sure i get you, the bookies had a very bad day with no outsiders winning and the highest sp 12/1 i am sure a lot of layers on betfair lost a lot of money however trading is taking a position and closing it before the off hopefully for a profit how do you get the random 4/6 market stat ?
We run tests on each market that we trade and use a 'base' strategy that has no skill to test the markets. Today most won.

I already know that is unlikely to happen tomorrow.
duggs
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:14 pm

There are loads of variables it could take ages to find a winning formula

so lets look at the different paramaters we can use

Race - The only profit came in a big field handicap but other competetive races produced a lost, races with odds on favourites also produced a lost
SP - I think 20/1 is too high could concentrating on the first 3 in the market produce a profit ?
Time - Up to 1 minute seems a bit short however i extended the time and it produced the worst lost of a the day
Stop Trigger - Would increasing it from 2 improve the results

To be honest not sure i will use it again for me the unmatched Back Bets that let this system down
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Euler
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duggs wrote: let this system down
As Dallas explained it's not a system, simply a building block for your own system or process. I suggest you use it that way.
melonhead
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Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 2:21 pm

After reading the forum and blog semi-professionally over the last 72 hours i have decided to dive in and try this little bit of kit out on Day 1 of Goodwood. Thanks for the effort put into this bot, hopefully it will be able to get me off on the right foot! Have made some small alterations to suit my liabilities etc. Wish me luck! :D
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Willygubbins
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Hi, i have had some reasonable success with my variation of this bot, by adding a weight of money condition and reducing the last traded price, how ever i have found that at times the lay bet is matched first and the back bet is left hanging, my question is, is there a way to set it so the lay bet is only presented if the back bet is matched?
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jimibt
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Willygubbins wrote:Hi, i have had some reasonable success with my variation of this bot, by adding a weight of money condition and reducing the last traded price, how ever i have found that at times the lay bet is matched first and the back bet is left hanging, my question is, is there a way to set it so the lay bet is only presented if the back bet is matched?
Willygubbins - yes, if you use the fill/kill option, then the leading bet is always placed first and the offset only placed on the fill/kill being successful. amend your rule to include this and you should be good to go.
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Willygubbins
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Hi, do you think i could do a lay side mirror of this in the same auto? or would it go haywire?
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jimibt
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Willygubbins wrote:Hi, do you think i could do a lay side mirror of this in the same auto? or would it go haywire?
yup, would be perfectly feasible. just ensure that you compare lay odds = lays odds 10 secs ago etc, etc. also, ensure that you place your bets by liability, rather than fixed amount.

[edit] - I quickly amended this for you -give it a try.
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Willygubbins
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thanks for that i'll have a look at it in a bit, going back to the kill or fill, I just tick the box in the parameters section pf the back bet rule? i just did that and run on a race and it only presented one back bet......now of course it is possible that it only met the conditions once however it seems odd....I've got it set to run on the next few races.
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jimibt
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Willygubbins wrote:thanks for that i'll have a look at it in a bit, going back to the kill or fill, I just tick the box in the parameters section pf the back bet rule? i just did that and run on a race and it only presented one back bet......now of course it is possible that it only met the conditions once however it seems odd....I've got it set to run on the next few races.
it should look something like this:
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Willygubbins
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ok, having a look at the file,i have a few questions, regarding the weight of money, if we are refering to the lay side are we not looking for the same weight as we are looking for on the back side to instagate a scalp that is going to drift as aposed to steaming? or is this more of a cover both bases? why is the reference to the lay price of those positions? why is the greening in the conditions aswell as the offset with greening? is there any way to add a condition that acknowledges if there is large sums of unmatched money holding it up? also I know betfair get the hump with practise mode, how much will i get away with (i am using it a little whilst i use practise mode for matched bets etc)? thanks again.
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jimibt
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Willygubbins wrote:ok, having a look at the file,i have a few questions, regarding the weight of money, if we are refering to the lay side are we not looking for the same weight as we are looking for on the back side to instagate a scalp that is going to drift as aposed to steaming? or is this more of a cover both bases? why is the reference to the lay price of those positions? why is the greening in the conditions aswell as the offset with greening? is there any way to add a condition that acknowledges if there is large sums of unmatched money holding it up? also I know betfair get the hump with practise mode, how much will i get away with (i am using it a little whilst i use practise mode for matched bets etc)? thanks again.
willy, quick explanation:

1. the WOM is a single value that reflects the weight of money against the lay price. We can thus use it such; less than 35% to represent more weight on the back (i.e. more money being offered up as backs) and conversely, a number such as greater than 65% to infer that the price action is focussed on the lay side of the book. The numbers i had chosen are purely arbitary and can be changed as required.

2. Regards the lay price < lay price in pos #4. When comparing relative prices, I tend to use the lay price if comparing BELOW the target and use the back price if comparing above the target. Just an idiosicracy of mine. You could use back < if you preferred and would achieve the same result. The entire reason for this condition is to ensure that we are not placing bets on wild outsiders that could change direction in a flash.

3. The greening conditions are in the rule so as not to place bets when the overall position on the market is either really highly exposed and likewise not to place bets when the market is in a healthy state of green. This can be a lifesaver as it means that you have a fairly predictable position in the market at all times (i.e. you know you'll not be firing off more bets when your overall position is doing badly). Again, remove it if not applicable in your scenario

4. There is no way to use the rules conditions (at present) to data mine the market depth to obtain this info.

5. Re practice mode. I've got many trial rules running in practice mode all day long and have yet to get banned by betfair for this practice. That said, this could be because i do put the odd real bet thro the market every now and again, so this may keep my account sweet.

Hope this helps. I guess I'm saying that all those conditions that you queried are optional extras and their removal or change will affect the overall position, so experiment.

cheers
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Willygubbins
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thank you for your explanations, it is greatly appreciated. i cant just copy something blindly i need to understand the logic, it is a bit late for me to fully digest, i will absorb tomorrow and report back. :) :) :)
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Willygubbins
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so the early signs are good, i have changed liabilty to stake.......but i now means both steaming and drifting tradfes offer equal value, it seems to favour the drifting scalps....im sure it is just how the market is behaving. overall very impressed with its functionality. if i were to up the stakes then i would need to adjust the greening up conditions to suit? how much differently will this behave in a real market re matching bets in your experience?
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