Admission time, and a question or two :(

Trading is often about how to take the appropriate risk without exposing yourself to very human flaws.
stueytrader
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Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

I also like the idea of someone objectively observing me - unfortunately, not sure I have anyone available to do that. Maybe I'll record myself sometime, I know some do that.
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LeTiss
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The last time I went 'In Play' was New Years Day 2008 - I lost £2000

I printed the disastrous trade off, and pinned it to my wall.

From that moment on, I was constantly reminded what can happen when you don't 'red up' a bad trade - after a while, it all become second nature and I've never let a bad trade go 'In Play' since. I would never have made it to self-employment if I hadn't done that
stueytrader
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Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

LeTiss wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 11:46 am
The last time I went 'In Play' was New Years Day 2008 - I lost £2000

I printed the disastrous trade off, and pinned it to my wall.

From that moment on, I was constantly reminded what can happen when you don't 'red up' a bad trade
Yep, I've heard that trick mentioned a couple of times before - stick up your worst memory/trade and it will keep it in mind, and hopefully stop you even thinking about repeating it. There is an interesting issue in making the denial of our poor behaviours something that is second nature as you suggest. That way it is less an active task to prevent poor behaviours/choices, rather just make it implicit that these don't cross our minds at all as an option - I hope to achieve that level of mental control one day!
Halliday
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Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:40 pm

stueytrader wrote:
Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:22 pm
to75ne wrote:
Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:33 pm
this topic and been covered many times and by many people who have faded away.
I do know the idea of control generally is a repeated area yes, though I'm more wondering what some may have used as very specific strategies/behaviours, and specifically on the staking side of the coin.

I realise going on tilt as a wider issue is something that is common in this area.
Tend to agree that this topic has been covered many many times on here , and all the info you think you might need is in those threads .But I suspect Stuey the simple fact is that "trading " for whatever reason just isn't for you.

Despite all the Psychology you quote , I suspect the simple fact is that maybe your just no good at it, it may seem harsh but we've been here so many times with other posters. So your probably just kidding yourself that you can succeed

I've said it many times that people tend to overcomplicate things , or blame various factors ( fatigue among many others being one of yours ) for their own failings .

Keep it simple, protect your bank, and enjoy ..
stueytrader
Posts: 863
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

Halliday wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:10 pm
stueytrader wrote:
Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:22 pm
to75ne wrote:
Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:33 pm
this topic and been covered many times and by many people who have faded away.
I do know the idea of control generally is a repeated area yes, though I'm more wondering what some may have used as very specific strategies/behaviours, and specifically on the staking side of the coin.

I realise going on tilt as a wider issue is something that is common in this area.
Tend to agree that this topic has been covered many many times on here , and all the info you think you might need is in those threads .
If you 'reduced down' some of the more general descriptions/discussion to specific behaviours then possibly yes, (I know there's some good postings related to the area) - that's essentially what I'm asking about.

ps. I know there's the possibility (with any trader) that they're 'not good enough', and I'm more than aware that could apply to me. But this has been a refreshing project since I originally posted, for my mindset and trading experience. I've even managed to not let some 'potholes' affect me recently, which in the past would have stopped me. I've traded long enough to know whether I'm any good at the meat and drink of the trading process, so that's not my main worry - my psychology has been though at times, and that is what I'm currently dedicated to working on. So far, so positive.
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gutuami
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Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:06 pm

there are two quotes that I like a lot:
1. If you keep on doing what you’ve always done, you will keep getting what you’ve always gotten
2. Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.
― Henry Ford
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Derek27
Posts: 23468
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Whenever I've been through a bad trading patch, the one thing that keeps my confidence up is looking at my accounts.

I've had the odd losing month, but never a losing quarter, nevermind year, which makes me feel I've been here before but still ended the year with a worthwhile profit.

If you ever reach the stage where you're making a long term loss, that's the time to either quit or trade with minimal stakes/capital until you find you're making a consistent profit again.
Bluesky
Posts: 420
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:26 pm

Derek27 wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:38 am
If you ever reach the stage where you're making a long term loss, that's the time to either quit or trade with minimal stakes/capital until you find you're making a consistent profit again.
I like this, it can be easy to fool yourself either on the up side or down side but the bottom line doesn't lie.
stueytrader
Posts: 863
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

gutuami wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:06 am
there are two quotes that I like a lot:
1. If you keep on doing what you’ve always done, you will keep getting what you’ve always gotten
2. Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.
― Henry Ford
Like the quotes - for number 1 I see there's a good implicit issue of 'change'. Not easy, but perhaps essential to improving results.
stueytrader
Posts: 863
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

Bluesky wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:10 am
Derek27 wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:38 am
If you ever reach the stage where you're making a long term loss, that's the time to either quit or trade with minimal stakes/capital until you find you're making a consistent profit again.
I like this, it can be easy to fool yourself either on the up side or down side but the bottom line doesn't lie.
I had about a year of profit, and I actually posted on here the question of how long is enough to judge - sadly my latest year is not in profit. But I'm aiming to revert back to the earlier year! There is something of a question of time-spans in judging success too - a piece of string kind of question, but the aim to use longer views of profit/loss is good I agree.
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Derek27
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Location: UK

If you were profitable previously, the important thing to do is look closely at your current trading and figure out what you're doing differently.

In my case, I realised I was getting complacent, overstaking, and then forced to trade out to stop the loss, whereas if I used more sensible stakes I would have had the luxury to wait and catch a profitable trade. I was also spending less time analysing the market as I believed I'm so experienced now winning is just second nature. :lol:

In particular, look closely at the markets where you lost more than you intended to risk and consider what you could have done differently, i.e. smaller stakes, getting out earlier, more cautious swings etc.
stueytrader
Posts: 863
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

Derek27 wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:50 am
If you were profitable previously, the important thing to do is look closely at your current trading and figure out what you're doing differently.

In my case, I realised I was getting complacent, overstaking, and then forced to trade out to stop the loss, whereas if I used more sensible stakes I would have had the luxury to wait and catch a profitable trade. I was also spending less time analysing the market as I believed I'm so experienced now winning is just second nature. :lol:

In particular, look closely at the markets where you lost more than you intended to risk and consider what you could have done differently, i.e. smaller stakes, getting out earlier, more cautious swings etc.
Yep, can see some of those bad habits in my poor times too Derek, especially the overstaking problem. One thing I have found is that sometimes the smallest overstaking (which you get away with) leads to repeating the habit, in essence it can become a 'habit' if not careful. When doing well I was rigidly disciplined in my staking, so I know that is a big difference for me. I feel in general I had my psychology working correctly, but it slipped somehow and that's what I'm looking to redress.
spreadbetting
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stueytrader wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:28 am

I had about a year of profit, and I actually posted on here the question of how long is enough to judge - sadly my latest year is not in profit. But I'm aiming to revert back to the earlier year! There is something of a question of time-spans in judging success too - a piece of string kind of question, but the aim to use longer views of profit/loss is good I agree.

I can see the mentality of looking at longer periods to assess your capabilities when gambling but trading is a different kettle of fish , you're generally turning over so many markets things become quite obvious quickly if you can win or not. I think there always comes a point with trading where you become confident in your own ability to win simply because you understand the reasons why you're winning.
stueytrader
Posts: 863
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

spreadbetting wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:09 pm
stueytrader wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:28 am

I had about a year of profit, and I actually posted on here the question of how long is enough to judge - sadly my latest year is not in profit. But I'm aiming to revert back to the earlier year! There is something of a question of time-spans in judging success too - a piece of string kind of question, but the aim to use longer views of profit/loss is good I agree.

I can see the mentality of looking at longer periods to assess your capabilities when gambling but trading is a different kettle of fish , you're generally turning over so many markets things become quite obvious quickly if you can win or not. I think there always comes a point with trading where you become confident in your own ability to win simply because you understand the reasons why you're winning.
Possibly true, though I still think the principle of using a 'looking back further' approach is still a good one for keeping yourself in check, in several ways.
Halliday
Posts: 460
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stueytrader wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:44 pm
spreadbetting wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:09 pm
stueytrader wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:28 am

I had about a year of profit, and I actually posted on here the question of how long is enough to judge - sadly my latest year is not in profit. But I'm aiming to revert back to the earlier year! There is something of a question of time-spans in judging success too - a piece of string kind of question, but the aim to use longer views of profit/loss is good I agree.

I can see the mentality of looking at longer periods to assess your capabilities when gambling but trading is a different kettle of fish , you're generally turning over so many markets things become quite obvious quickly if you can win or not. I think there always comes a point with trading where you become confident in your own ability to win simply because you understand the reasons why you're winning.
Possibly true, though I still think the principle of using a 'looking back further' approach is still a good one for keeping yourself in check, in several ways.

I agree with the post by spreadbetting that because of the nature of trading you soon become aware if your any good at it or not , most of the time your your carrying out the same thought process and repeating similar trades over and over again, and the thought process becomes instinctive .
Reading your posts your putting far too much thought into something which isn't that complicated.Keep your trades simple, reapeat them over and over again, till you can implement them without thinking ...

If after a year your still question whether your successful, or feel the need to keep yourself "in check", or look for reasons( excuses) why it's not working . Then really it's not for you .It might be that you just don't have the character to make it work.

I don't think posting about what you appear to already know about your failings is going to change your approach etc , as you seem to have been at it for some time .

Good look anyway , and if you are determined to continue,rather than posting .. read the numerous replies to similar posts to yours .. If you really think it will help you ... I've lost count of the number of ground hog day " threads we have had !!
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