Trading Greyhound racing
I've argued for ages that Betfair should offer some level of proofing ability, it would really open up eyes to people who actually do it versus those that are all talk. As it is, people just mimic what real traders do and pass themselves off as real traders.
The only time someone else's success or failure would be relevant to me is if I'm thinking of taking a course or buying a system. And even then, it's of limited relevance.
An analogy. Is a beginner golfer going to learn more from a day with Tiger Woods than with the guy ranked 10,000 in the world? Also, while Woods is a great golfer, he might not be any good at explaining what he does.
Plus, is there not a risk that having such data would increase the amount of mimicry that goes on, as opposed to people coming up independently with theories of how the market works and then testing those theories?
I'm sure that many people have spent hours worrying about what your secret sauce is, for example, and trying to do what they think you're doing, when a more productive approach would be for them to find their own way (as you excellently demonstrated in your locks video the other day).
Jeff
An analogy. Is a beginner golfer going to learn more from a day with Tiger Woods than with the guy ranked 10,000 in the world? Also, while Woods is a great golfer, he might not be any good at explaining what he does.
Plus, is there not a risk that having such data would increase the amount of mimicry that goes on, as opposed to people coming up independently with theories of how the market works and then testing those theories?
I'm sure that many people have spent hours worrying about what your secret sauce is, for example, and trying to do what they think you're doing, when a more productive approach would be for them to find their own way (as you excellently demonstrated in your locks video the other day).
Jeff
I totally agree Peter, it's stunning that anyone can call themselves an expert and basically con people. It always surprised me Betfair didn't get involved in this.
It's not the only industry though, my industry is the same, there are people purporting to be experts and educators, they're charging all sorts of fees, basically it's the same problem, you cannot show earnings , or it's frowned upon.
Unlike my favourites poker and golf
It's hard to keep your earnings hidden live or online , OPR show details of ROI , some people exclude , but there are still ways to check, I had a guy offer me an online poker lesson , he was a loser , basically a fish trying to make money.
Golf the scores are there to see you can't cheat
Had lessons from the top coaches and some duffers who can't break 80. I know some great teachers are crap, but a simple check does the job
Funny most of the above frequent forums too. Not here of course!
Imagine having to show your profit and loss before you could teach trading
Sorry for the rant
DR
I think having a reviews site on the Betfair website where verified course attendees/system buyers could give feedback and provide ratings would be the best way forward.
That would tell me far more about what I would be getting for my money than would the trader's lifetime earnings.
Jeff
That would tell me far more about what I would be getting for my money than would the trader's lifetime earnings.
Jeff
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Surprisingly I'd have to agree with Jeff, just because someone's made a few quid doesn't mean they'd be able to teach you how to do it. Just about every website selling anything has some kind of ebay verified sales feedback these days. Screenshots and videos are easy enough to fake, especially for any of us making our own bots, genuine feedback from verified buyers on the Betfair website might not be as easy to fake.Ferru123 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:33 pmI think having a reviews site on the Betfair website where verified course attendees/system buyers could give feedback and provide ratings would be the best way forward.
That would tell me far more about what I would be getting for my money than would the trader's lifetime earnings.
Jeff
As for people posting 'possibly' faked pnl screenshots on here, as long as they're not touting systems or selling via PM, I'm not sure it makes any real difference, personally I find it amusing when someone's been making pennies then comes along a month later making thousands
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I believe a user rating system with feedback help others to decide whether the data provided is reliable or not. In terms of mass rating when averaged, it tends to give a more accurate prediction. Of course more the participants more accurate the results will be.
You would need to verify the rating though as competitors WILL try and trash others. When Betfair introduced a rating system for apps people started downvoting competitors. The industry has a veritable smorgasbord of fake review sites designed purely to dupe you into buying silly systems. Much better to cut it off at the source.
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After a few weeks of not trading the dogs (life got in the way... lol), I tried my new bot (huge work in progress and nothing fancy at all !!!!).
I was doing well, 1p here, 2p here and got to 6p. Happy until the bot fired up a trade against a high odd dog. Lost £7.10 in one trade... ouch that hurts. Lost a few usual trades 20p here and 48p over there.
As for the recent discussions lately in this thread, I do not believe in showing off your amazing results (real of fake) is helping anyone. It is hard enough for a newbie like me to learn how to trade.
I can understand that a real successful trader will never share their inner trade secrets, but I believe in helping others by putting them in the right track. I do believe in teach a man how to fish...
There is a big difference in asking someone to hand over their hard work for "free" (regardless on how long it took you to setup your bot) and asking the same person for a pointer, a hint, something to start off.
I was doing well, 1p here, 2p here and got to 6p. Happy until the bot fired up a trade against a high odd dog. Lost £7.10 in one trade... ouch that hurts. Lost a few usual trades 20p here and 48p over there.
As for the recent discussions lately in this thread, I do not believe in showing off your amazing results (real of fake) is helping anyone. It is hard enough for a newbie like me to learn how to trade.
I can understand that a real successful trader will never share their inner trade secrets, but I believe in helping others by putting them in the right track. I do believe in teach a man how to fish...
There is a big difference in asking someone to hand over their hard work for "free" (regardless on how long it took you to setup your bot) and asking the same person for a pointer, a hint, something to start off.
Never been a great fan of people posting their P/L, but can understand it might help motivate some,but unfortunately posters like Mephis have probably made them of no use in that respect.
I just find it rather sad that he continues with his delusions and untruths,as if you pick the bones out of some of his posts,it does show the potential of trading Greyhound markets.
So yes as Peter said it has made people look at trading greyhounds,but that doesnt negate being dishonest,and it does impact on those posting genuine P/L and our perceptions.
Anyway back to the delights of Chepstow and Hexham(and the one eyed Wazowski)
Yeah I agree with that. I can understand why Peter Webb would show P+L figures, as ultimately he wants people to see the benefit of trading, so he can flog his product. It's a bit like a guy selling burglar alarms, and part of his sales pitch is to show photos of burgled houses first.
However, if you're not selling a product, why would you show P+L to anybody else?
It either means they are bullshitters, or they are insecure and want to enter into a dick swinging contest
However, if you're not selling a product, why would you show P+L to anybody else?
It either means they are bullshitters, or they are insecure and want to enter into a dick swinging contest
+1
I think that, if a newbie has a really good day and feels they are making progress, and posts, 'I've made 50p today using £2 stakes, which is my highest total yet. Buzzing!', that's fine.
But, yeah, to post that you've made £500 in an afternoon when most people have to work bloody hard to make that much money is a bit crass.
Jeff
I think that, if a newbie has a really good day and feels they are making progress, and posts, 'I've made 50p today using £2 stakes, which is my highest total yet. Buzzing!', that's fine.
But, yeah, to post that you've made £500 in an afternoon when most people have to work bloody hard to make that much money is a bit crass.
Jeff
LeTiss wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:25 pmYeah I agree with that. I can understand why Peter Webb would show P+L figures, as ultimately he wants people to see the benefit of trading, so he can flog his product. It's a bit like a guy selling burglar alarms, and part of his sales pitch is to show photos of burgled houses first.
However, if you're not selling a product, why would you show P+L to anybody else?
It either means they are bullshitters, or they are insecure and want to enter into a dick swinging contest
I seem to be on a posting fizz (not quite a frenzy) this evening.
Results (if genuine) showing profit from automated bots are personally of interest to me because 1. You want to trust in the product and know its possible 2. Someone out there is smart enough to do it which is encouragement 3. Its definitely possible(again) as it is easy to think it is not.We are all in this together so one hopes for a strong integrity/sincerity gene- Life is hard enough otherwise
Results (if genuine) showing profit from automated bots are personally of interest to me because 1. You want to trust in the product and know its possible 2. Someone out there is smart enough to do it which is encouragement 3. Its definitely possible(again) as it is easy to think it is not.We are all in this together so one hopes for a strong integrity/sincerity gene- Life is hard enough otherwise