No Courtsiding

[tootall]

Just watching the darts and can not understand how odds move before live coverage ( I know its delayed) I assume its being played in separate rooms judging by coverage showing two different boards and no live audiences. So I assume its Belfair manipulating odds.

[Euler]

It's probably an inside job at the broadcaster at the tournament.

[ShaunWhite]

Is it the PDC Home Tour, the one broadcast from the players' homes?

How much is it delayed 2s, 2min ? Is there a clock visible at all the locations?

I think you've answered your own question though "(I know its delayed)" It'll just be people who see the action before you do, unless the cam is 360 degrees who knows what mates they've got on their laptops or looking through the keyhole. And if it's that Barry Hearn thing then I wouldn't put it past him to have a feed himself 2s ahead of the broadcast. Nothing ever anywhere is 'live' coverage.

Betfair have nothing to gain whatsoever by manipulating odds on the Exchange, unless you're talking about the Sportbook.

[delboy1234]

If you have got the correct satellite equipment there is normally always a live feed up for the darts that is slightly ahead of what you would see on Sky.
I am new to the world of trading (and this forum) and have spent the last few days watching a live feed and seeing how the market reacts. The constant swing in a match is fascinating.

Last night in the Smith vs Ratajski match, Smith hit a 180 to put himself in control before Ratajski took out a big 3 figure out to win the leg. I watched the third dart hit then two seconds later the market reacted.

What delay is there from Betfair on the darts markets? I've got lots of learning to do but being a darts fan I thought this could be a good place to start.

[Archery1969]

I mentioned on here a couple of weeks ago about a football VAR incident whereby the odds starting moving considerably before the Ref got the decision, it was something likes 12 seconds.

That means one or more of the following:

- Someone in the VAR box is illegally betting.
- Someone in the VAR box is passing the information onto someone else before the Ref.
- The feed to the Ref is being hacked.
- Someone has a hidden camera in the VAR box and is spying.

It was blatantly obvious something was going on so why is it not being investigated ?

[sa7med]

I mentioned on here a couple of weeks ago about a football VAR incident whereby the odds starting moving considerably before the Ref got the decision, it was something likes 12 seconds.

That means one or more of the following:

- Someone in the VAR box is illegally betting.
- Someone in the VAR box is passing the information onto someone else before the Ref.
- The feed to the Ref is being hacked.
- Someone has a hidden camera in the VAR box and is spying.

It was blatantly obvious something was going on so why is it not being investigated ?

Could also be people anticipating the decision before the Ref makes it.

[cmuddle]

I mentioned on here a couple of weeks ago about a football VAR incident whereby the odds starting moving considerably before the Ref got the decision, it was something likes 12 seconds.

That means one or more of the following:

- Someone in the VAR box is illegally betting.
- Someone in the VAR box is passing the information onto someone else before the Ref.
- The feed to the Ref is being hacked.
- Someone has a hidden camera in the VAR box and is spying.

It was blatantly obvious something was going on so why is it not being investigated ?

Could also be people anticipating the decision before the Ref makes it.

Yes agree, the market usually just reacts to the possible outcome, if there is decision to be made on penalty it will move

[Archery1969]

No way.

Someone put up £70k, it got filled and then price went down before the Ref got the decision.

How come the market wasn’t suspended.

You telling me someone guessed the outcome of the decision with £70k and got it bang on. If it had gone the other way they would have lost a serious some of money.

The VAR decision took 4 minutes.

[ShaunWhite]

No way.

Someone put up £70k, it got filled and then price went down before the Ref got the decision.

How come the market wasn’t suspended.

You telling me someone guessed the outcome of the decision with £70k and got it bang on. If it had gone the other way they would have lost a serious some of money.

The VAR decision took 4 minutes.

As you know you don't need to get it right, just more right than wrong. 70 grand isn't really a massive bet, not when you've got the likes of Tony Bloom turning over a million a game. That would be 14 x 70 grand bets (obv). Not saying that's who it is but it only looks like a big bet compared to this forum but it's not for people like him.

[Archery1969]

No way.

Someone put up £70k, it got filled and then price went down before the Ref got the decision.

How come the market wasn’t suspended.

You telling me someone guessed the outcome of the decision with £70k and got it bang on. If it had gone the other way they would have lost a serious some of money.

The VAR decision took 4 minutes.

As you know you don't need to get it right, just more right than wrong. 70 grand isn't really a massive bet, not when you've got the likes of Tony Bloom turning over a million a game. That would be 14 x 70 grand bets (obv). Not saying that's who it is but it only looks like a big bet compared to this forum but it's not for people like him.

Yeah I guess so.

The decision was about a penalty and possible red card.

But the way the odds had moved before the VAR decisions came back looked very suspect indeed.

I guess someone was just lucky then...

Looked as bent as a 12 bob note to me though. Not upset or angry as I didn’t place a bet but I nearly did. With hindsight.....

[marketraisen]

Could also be people anticipating the decision before the Ref makes it.

Was likely this, with so many games around the world now using the system theres often moments in a game that betfair will suspend later than you'd expect them to suspend on the biggest leagues without reversing bets. In the biggest matches, if they have a late VAR suspension typically they roll the market back to pre-incident (as their rules say they will).

In the early days of VAR when it was just the German leagues, the MLS and I think Portugal using it, the whole experience was quite a fun thing to bet, crazily sometimes they wouldnt even suspend the "Sending off" market which I was able to hoover a couple of times with no reversals. Sucks for the guy on the other side putting up the fairer prices but the guys laying 1.05,1.1etc also getting swept up are pretty exploitative themselves looking to catch people making mistakes, so no guilt with those. Plus they shouldve been more aware there was a fundamental change to the event and taken precautions.

The worst affected markets sadly I never took advantage of but I did try, I saw a few matches primarily in the late night MLS stuff where 4 minute decisions were the norm, after a minute or so Betfair would reopen the Correct Score market long enough that people were laying the usual '1000.0' to back on impossible selections. Well those people were getting their prices taken while the decision making was ongoing, a minute later the goal would be chalked off and the price on the correct score would plummet to 4.0 or whatever its true odds were, leaving a nice green for those who took it.
Had I caught any of them again I'd have had no guilt, anyone laying on a selection they believe is now impossible isnt betting, theyre trying to catch somebody making a mistake and they have been getting away with it for years.

[jamesedwards]

Often you can tell the decision way before the ref makes his signal. You can see the players listening into the ref's radio and turning around in disgust when they can hear it is not going to go their way.

[rik]

Just watching the darts and can not understand how odds move before live coverage ( I know its delayed) I assume its being played in separate rooms judging by coverage showing two different boards and no live audiences. So I assume its Belfair manipulating odds.

when the last time betfair video was the fastest information for any event? makes no sense your post

[firlandsfarm]

When there is an advantage/angle to be had you can bet someone somewhere will be exploiting it whether legal or not!

[Eboractos]

When there is an advantage/angle to be had you can bet someone somewhere will be exploiting it whether legal or not!

Exactly. When I went up to see England v Barbarians at Twickenham not so long ago I had Betfair open during the first 20 mins just to see whether I could place a few bets to cover the day's costs. Prices were moving in real match time so there were clearly people in the stadium trading the game live. As previously stated, if it can be used for a profit, someone will be doing it.