STOP LOSS how much does one allow to fall

[Layer2009]

Hi
there can anyone tell me is there a percentage that the stop loss should be set to after entry. I do most of my trading in running. i have a fixed liability open trade of £200 but set the stop loss to red up at 22% of that if i dont get the oppotunity to green up at my target of percentage of PNL. I find the National hunt races work fantastic with in running trading as they take much longer, all weather a bit different, any advice or should the stop loss cut off at the same as the PNL which i read in a Forex article, they call Ticks Pips. The £200 open liability is 5% of my bank size Any advice from other in running play members

Thanks

[Bet Angel]

I imagine if you use a stop loss in running it would get triggered a huge amount, so much it would make using a stop loss in running unviable?

[Layer2009]

I imagine if you use a stop loss in running it would get triggered a huge amount, so much it would make using a stop loss in running unviable?

I do agree but getting some ideas of Forex operators i have now actualy found a good setting in Running, it comes down to money management etc. It is better than me using my click to get out as it manages your decsision for a max loss. Forex operators use time management to hedge a trade, if done properly it pays even with horses

Thanks

[PeterLe]

Hi
there can anyone tell me is there a percentage that the stop loss should be set to after entry. I do most of my trading in running. i have a fixed liability open trade of £200 but set the stop loss to red up at 22% of that if i dont get the oppotunity to green up at my target of percentage of PNL. I find the National hunt races work fantastic with in running trading as they take much longer, all weather a bit different, any advice or should the stop loss cut off at the same as the PNL which i read in a Forex article, they call Ticks Pips. The £200 open liability is 5% of my bank size Any advice from other in running play members

Thanks

Hi Layer
I do a lot of inplay too (On Auto). I dont use a stop loss.
Just my opinion and I could be wrong; but I think the use of a stop loss wouldn't work (long term). Whilst the markets are efficient pre inplay..they tend not to be inplay (thats why I focus my attention there!)
A bit of a cliche' but at the end of the day it is a numbers game.
During inplay the prices swing dramatically as you know.
Something I do, which may help you (others)....Each morning I set the Sky+ plus to record the racing. I also set up my screen recording. At the end of the day I look at my P&L and determine the best result and the worse result. I then do a quick analysis of each. Its very easy to fast forward to the race you want to examine. You can literally use freeze frame and take as long as you need to dissect the race (very handy). You could adopt the same principle to see whether you would be better employing a stop loss or not? Even better...if it is practical. You could open a second account in the wife/girlfriends name (not both though!)...and split your stake and then do direct comparisons?? I do exactly this. It is very surprising how altering something by a tiny amount can change your P&L. (You need to run these type of test for at least 30 days in my experience or a good sample rate)
Yesterday I had two losing races totalling £33.86 (the biggest was -£30)...I watched this race again at 8pm last night and could see why the race lost. I reconised the pattern, I have seen it many times before.
In contrast my best race is attached. If you look at the lowest these traded in play (and assuming you were trading Rev Green or Quiet Whisper)..no stop loss would have worked here. In the business world the bottom line fig is often increased by cutting expenses (losses)...so I have strict policies on if/when I place a position in the first instance and then how I manage those liabilities real time. This in itself will increase you P&L over the course of the month. Although I dont have the data to prove conclusively whether a stop loss would work..my strong gut feel is that it wouldnt.
(One thing I'm looking at the moment is changing my staking policy..on the fly (ie real time)..I have been exploring the "Kelly Criterion"..A bit deep perhaps..but in the hope that someone out there is already doing this and/or from a mathematics background is reading this...I would be very interested to know if you have made this work???!
Hope that helps a little Layer?
Thanks
Peter

[PeterLe]

....Just by way of footnote...
If you do open a second account and you trade from the same PC (ie same IP Address...)...be careful as you would incur data req charges...(You can have the second account verified by betfair as independent)....or you could use a second VPS (ie unique Ip Address)..so that the accounts arent linked in any way....

[LeTiss]

In my experience, stop losses 'in play' are an absolute disaster. The markets can become very gappy and are often volatile, so the stop loss feature gets fired way too often.

[Layer2009]

Hi
there can anyone tell me is there a percentage that the stop loss should be set to after entry. I do most of my trading in running. i have a fixed liability open trade of £200 but set the stop loss to red up at 22% of that if i dont get the oppotunity to green up at my target of percentage of PNL. I find the National hunt races work fantastic with in running trading as they take much longer, all weather a bit different, any advice or should the stop loss cut off at the same as the PNL which i read in a Forex article, they call Ticks Pips. The £200 open liability is 5% of my bank size Any advice from other in running play members

Thanks

Hi Layer
I do a lot of inplay too (On Auto). I dont use a stop loss.
Just my opinion and I could be wrong; but I think the use of a stop loss wouldn't work (long term). Whilst the markets are efficient pre inplay..they tend not to be inplay (thats why I focus my attention there!)
A bit of a cliche' but at the end of the day it is a numbers game.
During inplay the prices swing dramatically as you know.
Something I do, which may help you (others)....Each morning I set the Sky+ plus to record the racing. I also set up my screen recording. At the end of the day I look at my P&L and determine the best result and the worse result. I then do a quick analysis of each. Its very easy to fast forward to the race you want to examine. You can literally use freeze frame and take as long as you need to dissect the race (very handy). You could adopt the same principle to see whether you would be better employing a stop loss or not? Even better...if it is practical. You could open a second account in the wife/girlfriends name (not both though!)...and split your stake and then do direct comparisons?? I do exactly this. It is very surprising how altering something by a tiny amount can change your P&L. (You need to run these type of test for at least 30 days in my experience or a good sample rate)
Yesterday I had two losing races totalling £33.86 (the biggest was -£30)...I watched this race again at 8pm last night and could see why the race lost. I reconised the pattern, I have seen it many times before.
In contrast my best race is attached. If you look at the lowest these traded in play (and assuming you were trading Rev Green or Quiet Whisper)..no stop loss would have worked here. In the business world the bottom line fig is often increased by cutting expenses (losses)...so I have strict policies on if/when I place a position in the first instance and then how I manage those liabilities real time. This in itself will increase you P&L over the course of the month. Although I dont have the data to prove conclusively whether a stop loss would work..my strong gut feel is that it wouldnt.
(One thing I'm looking at the moment is changing my staking policy..on the fly (ie real time)..I have been exploring the "Kelly Criterion"..A bit deep perhaps..but in the hope that someone out there is already doing this and/or from a mathematics background is reading this...I would be very interested to know if you have made this work???!
Hope that helps a little Layer?
Thanks
Peter

Hi
Peter it sounds preety to technical for me to go through all that but thanks for your input, good luck be on your side

[Layer2009]

In my experience, stop losses 'in play' are an absolute disaster. The markets can become very gappy and are often volatile, so the stop loss feature gets fired way too often.

Hi
Letiss the thing is my liability orders are usually £225 (lay first) that is a 8.33% chunk fom my total trading bank, good money management with trading says you get a bad trade or the trade is in your favour. I see the Stop loss as this,my target is not to take the full PNL of the open trade but only 8.4% of the open liability. This usually 87% of the time is in my favour and i green up once the target is met or even more, rather than having my total open liability eaten the stop loss cuts me out at the manageble lossed trade. I know the market can be very volitile but how many traders cut their loss when they are suppose to or stay in hopping their tumbling trade will turn arround, i have been there myself. You enter and exit when you have your prize,dont stay in to be eaten by the crocodiles, when they approach jump out with some limbs left