At 19.16 this evening BF posted a reversal on my account and deducted my (fortunate) profit. Since that time they altered the P/L to read "FIX" in place of the word "REVERSAL".
Betfair are from Mars...
Also posted in BF Down..
16.05 Ludlow Race Voided
Betfair wrote:Horseracing
Markets suspended, unmatched bets cancelled
Ludl 20th Mar / 16:05 2m Hcap Hrd
Ludl 20th Mar / 16:40 2m Hcap Chs
Chep 20th Mar / 16:15 3m Hcap Chs
Chep 20th Mar / 16:50 3m Hunt Chs
Wolv 20th Mar / 16:25 1m1f Sell Stks
Thurl 20th Mar / 16:30 3m Hrd
I am firmly in the camp (even though I came out on top in this event) that Betfair should Void all races where they have an outage or other software fault.
In this particular instance a strange message appeared in the blue event bar, one I had not seen before but I cannot recall the exact message. It was along the lines of "attempting to reconcile account balance".
It really isn't acceptable for Betfair to proceed and to settle races on the basis that customers who were prevented, because of a failure on their part, from getting their books in order before an event goes in play.
The only fair outcome is to void the race but in doing this Betfair would lose the commission on the event. This does seem to be the only reason Betfair will not void.
In this particular instance a strange message appeared in the blue event bar, one I had not seen before but I cannot recall the exact message. It was along the lines of "attempting to reconcile account balance".
It really isn't acceptable for Betfair to proceed and to settle races on the basis that customers who were prevented, because of a failure on their part, from getting their books in order before an event goes in play.
The only fair outcome is to void the race but in doing this Betfair would lose the commission on the event. This does seem to be the only reason Betfair will not void.
I agree with James1st, I also made money from it, but believe they should have voided the race.James1st wrote:I am firmly in the camp (even though I came out on top in this event) that Betfair should Void all races where they have an outage or other software fault.
In this particular instance a strange message appeared in the blue event bar, one I had not seen before but I cannot recall the exact message. It was along the lines of "attempting to reconcile account balance".
It really isn't acceptable for Betfair to proceed and to settle races on the basis that customers who were prevented, because of a failure on their part, from getting their books in order before an event goes in play.
The only fair outcome is to void the race but in doing this Betfair would lose the commission on the event. This does seem to be the only reason Betfair will not void.
Here's the problem with that Herbie. I traded out with Betdaq.herbie wrote:
I agree with James1st, I also made money from it, but believe they should have voided the race.
I won on Betfair and lost the equivalent stake on Betdaq. So if the voided the race where would that leave me?
If however, like James is advacating that all races are voided. And we knew this I wouldn't have traded out with BDQ and would have sat there with the confidence all is well. I'm for this. At least we would know where we stand. This could be applied to any outage within 5 mins of the start of a race and at any point during a race. ie late suspends - late in plays etc. As long as we know the rules we can work around them.
What we actually need is a very clear set of rules that are adhered to EVERY SINGLE TIME. It's the inconsistency that kills it. yesterday I knew what to do, and I did it. If at some point later on they started messing about with it then it all goes tits up.
My bet has stood btw. They removed it yesterday evening and reinstalled it late last night. If it's unmatched bets they voided, then that's standard practice. The worst ones are the ones that don't go in play- or go in play very late. So some bets are matched then voided. It becomes a real mess. As far as this race is concerned I thought it pretty straightforward. If not very unsatisfactory. Which I will be telling Mr Corcoron.
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
It should be straight forward with markets that go inplay late or not at all. Roll the market back to the official off time and treat bets as they were at that point in time. So if you had take SP selected for example it would be treated as a take sp.
Simples!
The only issue with voiding markets is the potential for a criminal to do a DDOS attack on BF if they have a position they want voided. How likely that is...probably very small.
As for saying 5 mins before the off, is that the official off or the scheduled off? If the first it is an known point in time as the actual off time is not known until it happens. In the case of scheduled off, that could be a long time before the actual off in cases where a meeting has been delayed for example.
Simples!
The only issue with voiding markets is the potential for a criminal to do a DDOS attack on BF if they have a position they want voided. How likely that is...probably very small.
As for saying 5 mins before the off, is that the official off or the scheduled off? If the first it is an known point in time as the actual off time is not known until it happens. In the case of scheduled off, that could be a long time before the actual off in cases where a meeting has been delayed for example.
mugsgame wrote:Here's the problem with that Herbie. I traded out with Betdaq.herbie wrote:
I agree with James1st, I also made money from it, but believe they should have voided the race.
I won on Betfair and lost the equivalent stake on Betdaq. So if the voided the race where would that leave me?
If however, like James is advacating that all races are voided. And we knew this I wouldn't have traded out with BDQ and would have sat there with the confidence all is well. I'm for this. At least we would know where we stand. This could be applied to any outage within 5 mins of the start of a race and at any point during a race. ie late suspends - late in plays etc. As long as we know the rules we can work around them.
What we actually need is a very clear set of rules that are adhered to EVERY SINGLE TIME. It's the inconsistency that kills it. yesterday I knew what to do, and I did it. If at some point later on they started messing about with it then it all goes tits up.
My bet has stood btw. They removed it yesterday evening and reinstalled it late last night. If it's unmatched bets they voided, then that's standard practice. The worst ones are the ones that don't go in play- or go in play very late. So some bets are matched then voided. It becomes a real mess. As far as this race is concerned I thought it pretty straightforward. If not very unsatisfactory. Which I will be telling Mr Corcoron.
Im saying the same thing Mugs. If the rules are set out before the market is made is is easier.
If betfair goes down then all bets are void, then we wouldnt go to betdaq to balance our book.. but as I write this, I realise that betfair would have to admit instantly that there was something wrong and post a big VOID instead of suspended. I dont see them being that efficient.
I dont feel good about being paid for this race. I got it in an unfair way, even though next time it could be me on the other side of it
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superfrank
- Posts: 2762
- Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:28 pm
A possible solution could be that Betfair gives pre-race traders an option in their account to say, if there is an outage that affects a racing event, please hedge all my open positions using BSP when you settle the market? (I'm assuming they calculate BSP in these cases???)
Personally I think they should void all events affected by outages, but understand that there are issues associated with this also.
Personally I think they should void all events affected by outages, but understand that there are issues associated with this also.
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
An extreme example but what about the winner of the Premier League market? The market would always be voided as you are bound to get one outage a year. I guess there would be a need for a cut off, perhaps if the market is due to be settled within the next XYZ mins/hours but as they are unlikely to know the potential duration of an outage it would be tricky to set a period.superfrank wrote:Personally I think they should void all events affected by outages, but understand that there are issues associated with this also.